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FS2004 AI engine smoke detaches on landing

Discussion in 'Living World & AI General' started by John Young, 9 Mar 2017.

  1. John Young

    John Young

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    I think this is a very old chestnut, but I haven't been able to find any posts on it.

    Can anyone tell me please what causes FS9 engine smoke on AI aircraft returning to base from a waypoint (VFR or IFR) to detach itself from the aircraft and elevate 60 or 70ft as soon as it crosses the runway threshold?

    [​IMG]

    It doesn't occur on AI aircraft flying local circuits. Adding a TNG in the flight plan at the home airport to force the aircraft into a circuit however, doesn't work. The problem doesn't occur at all in FSX.

    We've discussed this at MAIW and we believe there is no solution. Just wanted to ask the question here, just in case we are missing something.

    John
     
  2. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    please show us the aircraft.cfg to see which effect is used.
    It must be an effect problem, I suppose...
     
  3. tgibson

    tgibson

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    Hi,

    This is a bug in FS9 and I don't know how to fix it. Some airports are fine, others are not.
     
  4. John Young

    John Young

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    Thank you Tom, I thought you would know the definitive answer.

    John
     
  5. tgibson

    tgibson

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    That's one reason why I tag the effect to the landing lights, so at least they go away when the aircraft slows below around 40 kts or so. That way they don't follow the plane all the way to the gate. But then the smoke will not be present at taxi out, only upon taking the runway for takeoff (which is fine with me).
     
  6. John Young

    John Young

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    Yes indeed, I had done that too Tom. I'm also putting a mix of waypoint flights and local circuit flights (no smoke separation) in the flight plan to further minimise the problem.
     
  7. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    I tagged the effect to strobe and landing lights. I get no smoke while taxiing, but no othe problems.
    I confess, I have stored JYAI_Macdill_elevation.bgl in MacDills scenery, not in world\scenery...
    I am using Tampa and Petersburg photo scenery (lower layers than Macdill AFB).

    [Lights]

    //Types: 1=beacon, 2=strobe, 3=navigation, 4=cockpit, 5=landing

    light.0 = 3, -21.00,-57.80, 2.67, fx_JY_navredm ,
    light.1 = 3, -21.00, 57.80, 2.67, fx_JY_navgrem ,
    light.2 = 3, -11.74,-48.74, 3.01, fx_JY_navredm ,
    light.3 = 3, -11.74, 48.74, 3.01, fx_JY_navgrem ,
    light.4 = 3, -16.34, 0.00, 5.88, fx_JY_navredm ,
    light.5 = 3, -17.53, 0.00,-2.92, fx_JY_navredm ,
    light.6 = 3, -55.08, 0.00,23.40, fx_JY_navwhi ,
    light.7 = 1, -51.35, 0.00,24.08, fx_beaconb ,
    light.8 = 1, 30.72, 0.00,-5.00, fx_beaconb ,
    light.9 = 2, -21.23, -46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.10 = 2, 6.90, -24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.11 = 2, 6.90, -20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.12 = 2, 6.90, 20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.13 = 2, 6.90, 24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.14 = 2, -21.23, 46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    //
    //Engine smoke during taxi inhibited in FS9 - see manual
    //
    light.15 = 5, -21.23, -46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
    light.16 = 5, 6.90, -24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
    light.17 = 5, 6.90, -20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
    light.18 = 5, 6.90, 20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
    light.19 = 5, 6.90, 24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
    light.20 = 5, -21.23, 46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_sm_lear ,
     
  8. John Young

    John Young

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    I don't see the point of tagging the taxi smoke (fx_nicksmoke_AI_sm_lear) to the landing lights Guenther. Since landing lights only come on at the hold line you won't see the smoke before then, as you say. At that point the main engine smoke (AI_707) will trigger and because it's so dense, it will mask the taxi smoke anyway.

    When you observed flights returning from waypoints (not the local circuit flights), did the smoke stay attached?

    The elevation stub file goes in scenery\world\scenery so it is read first. Since I don't have the photo-scenery you mention, I don't know how that affects the elevations, but it sounds like they are working fine without it.

    John
     
  9. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    I observed both type of flights and the smoke stayed attached.
     
  10. John Young

    John Young

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    I haven't received any other reports either way, but I did test the smoke detachment using only the AFCAD present in the scenery folder and no stub file, but the smoke did separate on the waypoint flights. I guess we won't find the answer.
     
  11. tgibson

    tgibson

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    Interesting, I didn't think of an altitude stub file. I'll try that.
     
  12. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    I tried to double check it, but my pc is unstable since I rebuilt it. Some graphic driver problems, I suppose.
    As I watched the smoke before, it was not stopped, but continued above when the aircraft was rolling on the runway.
    The model of the B47 has a break chute far under the aircraft when I watched it by MCX.
    Any ideas about it?
     
  13. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    Now I could double check it and the smoke detached and followed above until the landing light was off.

    Is it really aircraft depending or airport depending?
     
  14. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    I replaced the B47s by B52s (jmai_b52_traffic8_sp3.zip on AVSim) and all works fine:
    Smoke at taxiing, not detaching at landing from B473)

    B52.jpg
     
  15. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    Next test:
    B47 with "smoke lights" of B52s (Type 1 and 2) smoke is detaching again.
    So it is aircraft (mdl) depending...

    The B52 mdls have a parachute correct aligned, the B47 has a parachute hanging down in MCX...
     
  16. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    It wasn't the parachute, but the touchdown effect.
    After replacing "fx_JY_empty" by "fx_nicks_tchdwn_m" (from the B52s) the smoke is no longer detaching.
    with following lights:
    light.9 = 1, -21.23, -46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.10 = 1, 6.90, -24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.11 = 1, 6.90, -20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.12 = 1, 6.90, 20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.13 = 1, 6.90, 24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.14 = 1, -21.23, 46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.15 = 2, -21.23, -46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.16 = 2, 6.90, -24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.17 = 2, 6.90, -20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.18 = 2, 6.90, 20.65, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.19 = 2, 6.90, 24.50, -1.42, fx_nicksmokeAI_707 ,
    light.20 = 2, -21.23, 46.42, -0.48, fx_nicksmokeAI_707

    :twocents:
     
  17. John Young

    John Young

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    Sorry your settings with the change of touchdown effect didn't work for me Guenther. The smoke still detaches on flights returning from a waypoint. In any case, I wouldn't want to assign fx_nicksmokeAI_707 as a type 1 (beacon) light and have it in use for taxi - it's just too heavy.

    John
     
  18. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    Hi John,
    I was so sure I had seen a landing from a waypoint with attached smoke.
    So I ran another test and the smoke detached.
    But today I had a landing, with smoke, detaching much deeper than usual, very strange.
    You can see the attached picture, it was flight 235 from B472 to KM47.

    I am also wondering, why the B52s do not detach smoke, when I replaced the b47s in your flightplans...

    B47.jpg
     
  19. John Young

    John Young

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    I really appreciate your efforts Guenther to find the solution, but I think as Tom said initially and as we've always thought at MAIW, it is a bug in FS9. Sometimes it happens, sometimes it doesn't. There is no problem with the same files, converted for FSX in that sim version. The uploaded B-47 zip gives a number of options for users to work around the problem in FS9, which is about all I can do at the moment.

    John
     
  20. hgschnell

    hgschnell

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    Thanks John for your answer,
    I really do not want to annoy you. I give no dime if the smoke detaches or not, but all my life (as far I worked in applications or systems) there was a reason for things that happened.
    If there is a fs9 bug, all can happen (random or by coincidence) and we have no chance to find a solution.
    :D
     

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