• Which the release of FS2020 we see an explosition of activity on the forun and of course we are very happy to see this. But having all questions about FS2020 in one forum becomes a bit messy. So therefore we would like to ask you all to use the following guidelines when posting your questions:

    • Tag FS2020 specific questions with the MSFS2020 tag.
    • Questions about making 3D assets can be posted in the 3D asset design forum. Either post them in the subforum of the modelling tool you use or in the general forum if they are general.
    • Questions about aircraft design can be posted in the Aircraft design forum
    • Questions about airport design can be posted in the FS2020 airport design forum. Once airport development tools have been updated for FS2020 you can post tool speciifc questions in the subforums of those tools as well of course.
    • Questions about terrain design can be posted in the FS2020 terrain design forum.
    • Questions about SimConnect can be posted in the SimConnect forum.

    Any other question that is not specific to an aspect of development or tool can be posted in the General chat forum.

    By following these guidelines we make sure that the forums remain easy to read for everybody and also that the right people can find your post to answer it.

Animation export to glTF?

Should ModelConverterX export animations to the glTF format?

  • No

    Votes: 5 5.7%

  • Yes, but only for well known developers

    Votes: 9 10.2%

  • Yes, but only for animations made in ModelConverterX

    Votes: 1 1.1%

  • Yes, but only when the developer has the modeldef.xml sources of all animations

    Votes: 13 14.8%

  • Yes, but I have another idea to prevent piracy (please post below)

    Votes: 4 4.5%

  • Yes, for everybody

    Votes: 56 63.6%
  • Total voters
    88
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hi all,

This is exactly the dillema. A developer like @Lagaffe who wants to convert his own work is the kind of user that I would like to support for MCX. Actually I have developed the logic to export the animations already and it has been proven by some developers that tests it that it saves them a lot of time as they can import the old model with all animations in Blender. This saves them 1 or 2 weeks of recreating all animations. But it will never be a fully automatic conversion, as materials and other aspcts have to be tuned by somebody who knows what he is doing.

But having such export capabilities generally available has two issues. One is the potential of conversions by people who are not the developers and just do a half port and release it. And the other is that once you can take a complex model into Blender you can easily export it for other uses as well, so this makes it a lot easier to steal the hard work of a developer. Before with only the ability to export animations to MDL you would at least stay within the FS community with the result.
 
Is there a way for you to ask for the original GMAX, 3DSMAX file to do a check of the animations names in that file and compare to the MDL? Not an import, just a read and verify. Maybe a if > 75% of the GMAX animation names match the MDL animation names then export, if not don't. Or am I completely missing the point?
 
Hi,

I'm not sure if I can read anything from the GMax or Max file, but it's an interesting thought.
 
My comment well up in this thread has seemingly gotten lost but I still think including some type of "watermark" is a way out of the dilemma. A dummy or hidden animation would at least allow for some traceback when intellectual property has been converted. But as I also stated, a clever pirate will figure out a way of how to overcome this approach. The point is that if there's a hidden threat it might deter the more casual users from thievery. I think that this approach is slightly better than just a message asking if the user has permission to convert a model.
 
Warning message on the Model ConverterX never worked.
Models were rippped off and more then that those were uploaded to the 3D model market and became like money laundering.
Even payware aircraft was ripped off and was uploaded to the 3D Market in the past.

Then what can really a watermark can do ?
Can it block and solve the matter?
Even hidden or not , I think evil modders will do once it's made.
Having inside has a meaning so I agree with that.

At this case , what I feel is giving the rights to the correct person is Must needed.
Giving everyone a way to export is wrong.
The matter is how can it be done.

Modeldef is one of the way , but still weak , but better then just none.

About the software itself , having the term for use like only works like 1 year is a good way so that new rules can be followed .
 
Last edited:
Hiroshi Igami said:
Then what can really a watermark can do ?
Click to expand...
I assume that Arno would add an animation (or whatever) to the converted file that is hidden in MCX. It would be best if Arno disclosed that to no one else. At least that way, If someone had an intellectual property complaint, it could be traced back to improper use of MCX. As best I can tell, there are always a few "stolen" models being offered for download. I am almost positive that there are XP11 models that originally came from FSX versions without the permission of the original author. But I'm not the original author and I am not in the business of accusing someone with only my casual observations to go on as evidence. Anyway, the process by which the original author seeks relief is convoluted and rarely is successful. The original author says, "This model looks exactly like mine!" The pirate says, "Prove it!". And so on. Something needs to be hidden from the users that can be shown only if there is a complaint about the porting of a model.

It's not a great solution, but it's somewhere between the two extremes. And a clever pirate could defeat it, if he or she became aware of the watermarking.
 
Atleast better then none so I agree with having a watermark.
But it won't be a help for saying yes to add animation exporting function to everyone at Model ConverterX.
Don't want to see again what 3DS export did.

And since FS2020 is a open format once it's out , will be completely easy to rip off and sell or use it for others and say it's mine.
Even wrong.
 
Last edited:
Hi all,

new to the forum (after some time away from Flightsim in general)
I did some FSX conversions with the concent of the original authors like the Milton Shupe DeHavilland Puss Moth.
I only made one plane for FS9 and FSX (the Douglas DC2 Uiver) and would love to get it going in native MSFS format.
I still have the gmax source, and ofcourse need to do a number of enhancements to the interior and exterior models, including texture mapping
Having an importer that could save me doing all animations would be a huge plus to take up this new task.
It will be enough work as it is;)
I'm planning to do all this in blender. I'm still figuring out where to start....:eek:

Alrighty. Here's to hoping to use the importer, and let's get started
 
Yes, animation export will not be available when imported from MDL or BGL. For the other formats I'll make it available soon.

I might hand out licenses to respected developers who want to convert some of their previous work.
 
arno said:
Yes, animation export will not be available when imported from MDL or BGL. For the other formats I'll make it available soon.

I might hand out licenses to respected developers who want to convert some of their previous work.
Click to expand...

That would be great if you could, don't mind paying either.
 
thommy24dd said:
no I do not know it, but I know it would be possible to convert .mdl into .gltf with working animations but someone is holding back it...
Click to expand...
Yes, technically it is possible to convert a MDL to a glTF with animations. But converting a model to glTF does also mean that it easily be loaded in many other programs, so therefore most developers have serious concerns about making such a capability generally available. That would make piracy of FS addons a lot easier. So that's why the feature is not accessible in MCX in the public release.
 
arno said:
Yes, technically it is possible to convert a MDL to a glTF with animations. But converting a model to glTF does also mean that it easily be loaded in many other programs, so therefore most developers have serious concerns about making such a capability generally available. That would make piracy of FS addons a lot easier. So that's why the feature is not accessible in MCX in the public release.
Click to expand...
I understand and accept your point and concerns! Thats why I am begging you to make it possible to use gauges and effects of MSFS2020 with .mdl. I do not need the conversion, if it is possible to get all this working with the old .mdl files..
 
But like OzWookie set whether gauges can be used in MDL files it not something that can be controlled by us as community. That is something the developers of MSFS have to implement in the sim engine. So nothing I can do about that.
 
arno said:
But like OzWookie set whether gauges can be used in MDL files it not something that can be controlled by us as community. That is something the developers of MSFS have to implement in the sim engine. So nothing I can do about that.
Click to expand...
so it is on you to allow us to use your knowlage for making it working with converting to glTF... this would help us to safe our money and waste it into scum like Bredok3D B737 Max8 and Blackbox Cessna L19....
 
I get the impression you are not a developer yourself and that you are mainly interested in porting over an addon that you bought for FSX/P3D into the new MSFS. From that point of view it saves you money to not have to buy another addon.

But you also have to consider it from the developer point of view (remember we are a community of developers here). The developers do also want to save their money, because if their work is heavily pirated they loose their income and in the long run that might even mean some developers don't want to make new addons anymore. So that is why the conversion to glTF with animations is not publically available. Once a model is put in glTF it becomes too easy to use it for other purposes, for example because it can be imported in Blender and used for other purposes. That is against the interest of the developer of the addon.
 
I have had my own work for FSX and P3D redistributed without authorization, by someone using the convenience of MCX. For context sake, the models were likely lifted from the Trimble Warehouse and converted to FSX format, where I discovered them; as opposed to having been re released into a later version of the sim, as described here.

It is possible that I am wrong about the use of MCX, as MCX itself depends upon proprietary tools, available freely, however that particular "artist" included default Sketchup textures that had been combined into a single texture sheet, exactly like the draw call minimizer algorithm produces, while I had made a photographic type texture for my FSX release, that I had not provided with the Trimble model.

My models are offered freely, to expand community skills, but not to provide what I considered to be deficient redundancies of my work, proprietary to another author. It may seem like creators are incredibly nuanced about the particulars of their releases.
arno said:
Yes, animation export will not be available when imported from MDL or BGL. For the other formats I'll make it available soon.

I might hand out licenses to respected developers who want to convert some of their previous work.
Click to expand...
Please tell us if you have made a decision about licenses and how to determine if one is respected, thanks.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top