Do AI flight plans work with FS2020

[jgarnold]

I have created a flight plan using one of the FS2020 aircraft which is supposed to work with AI flights (non UI).
I have tried using both my created water airport (addon) and a stock FS2020 land airport for departure (the aircraft is amphibian) yet when I start a (user) flight around 20 minutes before scheduled departure (I have also tried starting 10 minutes before) parked at a ramp next to all the available ramps I do NOT see my AI aircraft at any of the other parking 'ramps'. I have ensured I start the with the correct GMT/UTC time for the scheduled AI flight and the parking radius will 'fit' the wingspan of the AI aircraft.

Many years ago I created AI flight plans (using AIFP) for FSX and they all worked. Maybe I have overlooked something?

Has anyone managed to create an AI flight plan and can 'see' the AI aircraft when they start a flight using FS2020? If so I would be grateful for a copy to test. I have searched the usual FS2020 download web sites and althought they have an AI Flight plans section (in downloads) set up there are no flight plans yet. I am wondering if the FS2020 'engine 'doesn't yet work with (user addon) AI flight plans.

Thanks

 

[gadgets]

parked at a ramp next to all the available ramps I do NOT see my AI aircraft at any of the other parking 'ramps'.

Do you see your aircraft at VYR or not. Your use of the word "other" is confusing. Since you said it was parked at a ramp, I assume "yes".

Lots of people seem to be using AIFP successfully with MSFS. - including me for test purposes (but I no longer have those files). I had a look at the file you sent yesterday and it seems OK.

You are dealing with several unknowns: an unproven airport, an unproven flight plan, lack of familiarity with the process and sim, etc. I suggest you eliminate some of those - like using stock aircraft at only small, stock airports (where you can easily see the aircraft) until you successfully generate air traffic. There's also a trouble-shooting guide near the back of the user manual

 

[jgarnold]

Thanks Don,

The use of the word other was 'directed' at the other parking/ramps eg I started a flight with me selecting parking/ramp number 1 and there are 3 others viz number 2,3 and 4. The other referred to 'numbers' 2,3 and 4 where I would expect the AI aircraft to be parked before departure. Well that is the way I can remember it being in FSX.

I am positive most if not all users of AIFP are using it successfully with MSFS.

Yes indeed unproven airports and flightplans and that is why I asked (now plead) for a copy of a flight plan which is know to work so long as it uses stock FS2020 airports.

I tried CAP3 which is a stock F2020 airport (Sechelt Gibbons). That was the other airport I referred to eg "I have tried using both my created water airport (addon) and a stock FS2020 land airport. CAP3 IS a very small airport with one runway, short taxiways and only 4 peaking gates and a fuel box all close together so I can easily check for AI traffic.

I have read the trouble shooting guide and considered that I have all things set up correctly certainly a compiled flight plan package in my community folder.

I just wished someone else could help me out with a confirmed working flight plan and also what to expect to 'see' at the start airport.

I set AIRCRAFT TRAFFIC TYPE to AI OFFLINE and AI AIRCRAFT DENSITY to 10 (as I used to with FSX) AND I have also tried with it set to 100.

I find varying other parked aircraft when I start ONE appears to be the same as my AI aircraft (Cessna C172) BUT it has NO LIVERY. Could it be my AI aircraft? There are usually other parked aircraft of other types which have liveries. Don't know what causes them to appear but don't really care either.

 

[jgarnold]

Aha I considered removing the AI Trafiic folder (containing my AI Flight Plan) from the community folder and checked FS2020. That C172 with no livery was not there so I now assume it was my AI aircraft BUT I thought that I had started my 'flight' 20 minutes before the scheduled departure time and waited over 20 minutes and saw no 'activity'. Maybe I will try again. Surely starting 20 minutes before scheduled departure should allow it to depart at the scheduled departure time? And do FS2020 AI aircraft have no livery?

BUT the C172 with no livery also has wheels not floats.

I researched the aircraft.cfg for each of the wheeled, floats and skis versions and they all have [FLTSIM.n] sections with title = "Cessna 172SP Asobo AirTraffic nn" ; Variation name

Beats me how selecting Cessna 172SP Asobo AirTraffic 00 in AIFP finds the correct aircraft 'type' eg wheels, floats or skis.

 

[gadgets]

Beats me how selecting Cessna 172SP Asobo AirTraffic 00 in AIFP finds the correct aircraft 'type' eg wheels, floats or skis.

As you have discovered, there are three possible AI aircraft for each AI C172 variant. The way to fix this is for you to edit the titles of the latter two by suffixing them with -"Floats" or "Skis" respectively. Clearly, Asobo hasn't yet got around to "cleaning up AI traffic".

But this is unlikely to be the cause of your main difficulty. If you see the AI Aircraft anywhere, the traffic file is OK. A couple days ago, I suggested you take CEA5 out of the equation and try using two small stock airports. Did you do that? Perhaps MSFS has sensed some difficulty with CEA5. Or maybe you are looking at the wrong time.

And yes, MSFS aircraft are textured. You can confirm that by looking at the assigned textures in MSFS. The absence of texturing you see may be another clue that MSFS AI traffic still has some difficulties - at least with the C172. Perhaps its confusing itself with the duplicated titles.

 

[gadgets]

Further to my earlier post, I have been exploring your missing textures. The aircraft you see IS textured, but the texture features are minimal. I suspect what you see is a basically all-white aircraft. (If it wasn't textured, it likely would be all black or all-grey.) What I did discover, however, is that the AI folders for C-172 are a mess. The texture and model files designated in the aircraft.cfg file for "Floats" and "Skis" don't exist in the proper folders. You can fix this since they do exist in the folder for the "wheels" aircraft (where they don't do any good) by moving them to where they are needed.

Unless you (or someone else) do some serious editing of those folders, your "floats" scheme just isn't going to work (and it's not the fault of AIFP).

 

[jgarnold]

Thanks again Don

A couple days ago, I suggested you take CEA5 out of the equation and try using two small stock airports. Did you do that? Perhaps MSFS has sensed some difficulty with CEA5.

I have never used CEA5. I have been using CAP3 (originally using CAX3 which is my developed water airport) which is quite a small airport but not as small as CEA5. Maybe I will substitute CYVR (large DESTINATION) with CEA5 as the destination although I'm not sure that would make any difference when 'basing' myself at CAP3 to look for AI.

Sorry about choice of word texture should have used livery. What I meant was that what looks like a C172 I saw was for all intents and purposes all white with no marking (eg no tail number) that I could see. There were two other aircraft sometimes positioned at some of the other 'ramps' but they were highly colored (not white) and nothing like a C172. I wonder where they would come from (internal FS2020 AI?) as sometimes I see them and sometimes I don't.

I didn't know that stock aircraft files could be modified as when I try and copy files at times I am prevented from doing so. I decided to 'have a go' and added 'float' to the respective aircraft and voila I now see them displayed when doing a mass aircraft update.

Unless you (or someone else) do some serious editing of those folders, your "floats" scheme just isn't going to work (and it's not the fault of AIFP).

I blame Asobo for not making the aircraft title (variation name) for more indicative of which type each C172 variant is as the wheeled, floats and ski type all have the same.

Maybe when I first started using AIFP (for FS2020) and using my water airport the AI C172 being the wheeled version selected was never seen as it would have sunk

Using a different C172 'traffic' aircraft I now see a different livery parked so I am assuming I have success. BTW just what is the minimum time to start a flight before scheduled departure of my AI aircraft as I have tried a few different times and never seen my AI aircraft startup and taxi.

Seems most if not all my problems have occurred because I chose to use the AI C172 aircraft with many variations. Some more things to try. Thanks for your assistance.

 

[gadgets]

I didn't know that stock aircraft files could be modified

Any file can be modified - you just have to be aware of the consequences. In the case of MSFS, your changes will be overwritten with the next update, so you will need to make a copy of the edited files so you can restore your edits after an update. On the other hand, the C172 other than the wheels version is unusable as is (as you've discovered.

A couple examples of what you'll have to do to use the Floats:

1. Suffix the titles of the four AI aircraft with "_Float" ( or whatever)
2. Delete the folder "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters\model" and replace it with the four folders named Model.Air Traffic -> Model.Air Traffic_3, which you'll find in "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000" folder
3. Delete the folder "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters\texture" and replace it with the four folders named Texture.Air Traffic -> Texture.Air Traffic_3, which you'll also find in "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000" folder.
4. Make a backup copy of "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters"

Alternately you could add the [Fltsim.n] entries from "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters\aircraft.cfg" suffixing the titles as above and place them (suitably renumbered in "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000\aircraft.cfg" folder. You could then simply delete "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters" or disable its aircraft.cfg file to prevent the old data from showing up in listings of aircraft

 

[jgarnold]

Thanks I was not aware that I needed to also perform (steps) 2,3,4
I have done the 'suffix' on the aircraft titles and then they shows in AIFO as separate C172s and so I though that was all that was required.

A GREAT pity that Asobo isn't "on the ball"

Pity there isn't an AI floatplane which ONLY has the float variant.

Yes I will have to remember to 'update' those files/folder every time there is an update.

 

[gadgets]

I have done the 'suffix' on the aircraft titles and then they shows in AIFO as separate C172s and so I though that was all that was required.

Unfortunately the model and texture files designate in the "Floaters" aircraft.cfg are not in the "Floaters" folders. The required model and texture files (ie, that are designated in the "Floaters" aircraft.cfg are up in the "wheels" folder. But, I just realized that even if you do this you are still likely to be disappointed since there is only one set of AI traffic model files which are called from three different configurations - wheels, floaters and skis. It seems doubtful that, even with the changes I suggested, that you are going to see floats. But, at least, you'll be able to choose.

 

[jgarnold]

thanks

BUT

I decided to make a backup copy of the entire folder "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters BEFORE making changes and was not permitted (your organisation does not allow you to place this file here).
So I tried 'sending' the folder to a zip file - no error or warning message but it didn't do it.
How do I backup such a folder then?

 

[=rk=]

A GREAT pity that Asobo isn't "on the ball"

It seems doubtful that the Xbox users have this same conclusion and console users pay the bills.

The Asobo motto should be, "Yes, we are fully prepared to develop a game that simulates every possible version of flight."

 

[jgarnold]

Hi Rick
Surely the Xbox version also has the problem outlined above vix AI C172 with aircraft titles which are the same for the wheel, floater and ski variations?

 

[jgarnold]

Don it appears that I do get my AI aircraft displayed parked at the departure airport. It is a C172 and the livery is what I expect when I view the DDS files in texture folder for that variant (I chose the 03 listed aircraft).
However no matter what I do the aircraft never starts up and taxis for takeoff as I have started a flight 20 minutes before scheduled departure left the PC and came back 22 minutes later and my selected aircraft is till sitting there. Mind you it displays with 'texture' indicating the prop is revolving which I don't believe.
I have read the section (13) of the manual for possible reasons and don't have any of those 'situations'.
My flight plan contains only one flight repeated every 24 hours. Will the next departure display even though it is 23+ hours before departure? My flight plan departure time is 2000 GMT and I have started a flight at 6:40 PM UTC, 7:40 PM UTC and 8:40 PM UTC (just in case my maths are wrong).
Where do I look next?

 

[=rk=]

Xbox users have no access to DevMode, Community Folder, most addons, what we would call advanced features - while simultaneously ignoring the fact that Xbox integration is the sims latest and therefore most advanced feature.

 

[gadgets]

(your organisation does not allow you to place this file here).

I've never seen this message before. It seems to suggest you are not using standard Windows.

My flight plan departure time is 2000 GMT

Is your system displaying local time or GMT or Local time?

My flight plan contains only one flight repeated every 24 hours.

I trust you mean one return flight

If the aircraft shows up anywhere - as is happening - your traffic file is being executed. The rest is up to MSFS. I don't use MSFS and am not really familiar with its innards. Someone else will have to step in.

 

[jgarnold]

I've never seen this message before. It seems to suggest you are not using standard Windows.

I have Windows 10 HOME installed.

Is your system displaying local time or GMT or Local time?

AIFP is set to UTC/Greenwich My (PC) system is set to local time

I trust you mean one return flight

Yes

It seems I have been at a bit of a disadvantage since I started firstly with some strange messages for addon airports, ### not disappearing even after save (now all fixed thanks), choice of an aircraft which has 3 undercarriage variants resulting in other issues and now Windows which refuses to allow me to backup a FS2020 folder. GRRRRR.

 

[gadgets]

AIFP is set to UTC/Greenwich My (PC) system is set to local time

So you are compensating mentally for the 8hr time difference

Windows which refuses to allow me to backup a FS2020

That's a most unusual message which, as I said before, I've never seen before. The reference to "your organization" suggests there's a setting somewhere that shouldn't be in a private environment. Perhaps some research on your part is in order.

 

[jgarnold]

So you are compensating mentally for the 8hr time difference

Not sure what you mean as when I start a flight in FS2020 I assume that the time I select is local time at CAP3 which is 8 hours different from GMT. Maybe I was adding the 8 hours instead of subtracting it (and maybe I should be using local time in my flight plans whioch takes away the possibility of maths error). I will rethink that maybe although years ago I developed AI flight plans for CAX3 (Sechelt water airport), used GMT and can't remember having problems but the years have rolled on and so has my age.
I any case when I start a flight I set the time of day at just before 8PM UTC/GMT (which is 20:00 GMT) which is the departure time in my flight plan (20:00 with GMT time zone selected). The reference to 8 hours is because I know that local time at CAP3 is 8 hours before GMT.

That's a most unusual message which, as I said before, I've never seen before. The reference to "your organization" suggests there's a setting somewhere that shouldn't be in a private environment. Perhaps some research on your part is in order.

I just remembered that the PC shop did not set up 'users' (for login) and so the bootup continues through that part where you are requested to choose who to boot up for. Its never bothered me as I am the only user for my PC. Also I have never seen this with any other app I run and just thought it was Asobo's method of protection against pirates. I will do some research.
It's all turning into a nightmare.

 

[jgarnold]

Just found the following -

It (error your organisation does not allow you to place this file here) is a bug that occurs if MSFS isn’t installed on your windows drive. Meaning, that in order to work around the problem, you need to move MSFS to your windows drive.

Oh isn't that just dandy. I have FS2020 installed on my D: drive and from another reply in the same thread the author stated he tried to move FS2020 and couldn't.

Being a trier of anything I can think I tried copying a folder from FS2020 to my D: drive the same as where FS2020 installed. Same problem. Also tried copying it to my C: drive and of course the same problem.

Surely there must be other users of FS2020 who decided to install on a different drive than the C: drive or am I the only one?

I think it is time to wave the white flag and give up.

BUT to my amazement I have just found that I can copy files to my FS2020 folders. I can copy to but not from. Where is the logic in that?

As such I would appreciate it if some one could Zip up the contents of "...\Asobo_C172sp_AS1000_Floaters" folder and send it to me. Thanks