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gmax and fsx aircraft

Messages
50
Forgive me, I know the subject has come up before.

Are we able to create aircraft with gmax? I see some posts saying we are waiting for the update to the sdk. I have the update, and still don't understand, or is there another update in the works?

Can I, and how do I, create the x file to use with xtomdl using gmax?

Should we also be creating an x file for scenery objects, and converting it?
 
Using the SDK Service Pack, you will find all you need to create aircrafts and scenery in FSX format.

Just copy the FSX_GmaxGamePack folder to the gamepacks folder of GMAX and tame your gmax.ini.

The results are more than rewarding!
 
Forgive me for being a little short here. This is probably the most helpful site available, and I really appreciate what's done here.
But replys like "read the sdk" really get my goat. You should assume people asking questions have attempted to find answers in the sdk, and other sources, failed, and are very frustrated. At least tell where in the sdk to look, or point to an appropriate post where the question has been asked or answered. I don't even mind things like " search for x subject or x author.

Perhaps I should have asked more detailed and direct questions? I'll try again.

I'm one of those people who has a great deal of trouble understanding the sdk's. They are, in my oppinion, very poorly done. Related info is scattered in different documents. Everything is written for 3ds max, and I have some trouble translating that to gmax. Most information given assumes that you already understand every other related detail. Imagine if the only instructions you had available when you got your first computer were simply "turn on the computer and save the projects you create in the format required". Theres a lot of important steps missing there.

I try to find my answers in the sdk first, and have about a 20% success rate.

In the "using modeling tools" sdk I find-

"To export the model, make sure the format Flight Simulator Direct X File (*.X) is selected, no other model format will work. If the option Flightsim Model (*.MDL) is shown, do not use it, it has not been implemented in this release."

In other sections I find comments like -

"To create Flight Simulator X models, aircraft or scenery, a new tool, XToMdl, has been introduced. The previous tool, MakeMDL, is now deprecated as are all models created from the ASM source. Models created with MakeMDL will still continue to function with Flight Simulator X. For backwards compatibility, XToMdl will read .x files from previous versions of Flight Simulator and produce a model for Flight Simulator X. Conversion of materials from pre-Flight Simulator X models may result in issues related to specular power and color. This is usually due to these values being zero in the .x file."

Using only the sdk for reference, it appears I can no longer make scenery or aircraft with gmax.

I also attempt to search the forums for an answer first. I have found commnts like-

"From what I know (which isn't too much), gmax is over. Now you use 3ds Max to design, export as .X and convert it to .mdl."

"gmax is NOT dead. You just cannot, *at this time*, create a true FS-X model. The ACES team are working on the gmax plugns/new gamepack."

I have the update to the sdk, but see no reference to creating an x file with gmax, and I don't find an x file option anywhere in gmax. Is there another sdk update in the works that I should wait for?

I'm not doing any projects of my own anymore. I am attempting to update the work I have for other peoples projects as they make FSX versions of those projects. I really don't want to give something that's going to be problematic to someone else, and make it their problem.
That said, I have been exporting scenery objects using the "Flightsim Model (*.MDL)" option. The sdk tells me that's wrong. What is the proper method?

I have a few "aircraft" type models that are being used by other people. There are lots of untextured parts on these that are now black in FSX. They need to be made FSX compliant. I've ignored what the sdk says, and exported them using "Flightsim Model (*.MDL)". I've been unable to make aircraft mdl's created in this manner work in FSX. Will they work? If yes, I'll attempt to figure out what I'm doing wrong in the different cfg files. If they won't work, is there any way to export aircraft with gmax, or does that require that I invest $3000+ to purchase 3ds max so I can make things that work in FSX and give them away for free?
 
Peace, Larry! I do understand your frustration... :)

Let's start at the beginning, shall we? First a bit of "history." The SDK released on DVD#1 of FSX was indeed incomplete: it did not have the "GMax export module and associated Scripts" included, as they were not ready at the time.

Some few months after release, the SDK SP/1 was released (the Update) which no only added the GMax specific content, but also updated quite a few other SDK's at the same time.

Granted, the current SDK's still aren't nearly as good as they need to be, but they are very much improved over the FS9 SDKs... Yes, there is quite a bit of inter-relatedness between various portions of the SDK, but there are many cross-reference links that may be used to navigate.

As I am an aircraft modeler, the following is very much "aircraft centric," so please bear with me... :cool:

The very first thing is to get GMax setup properly.

1) Look here: ..\SDK\Environment Kit\Modeling SDK\FSX_GmaxGamePack and copy/paste the entire FSX_GmasGamePack folder into your existing GMax installation under ..\Gamepacks... Here is how my GMax \gmax\gamepacks is structured:

Code:
Directory of C:\gmax\gamepacks

04/06/2005  04:18 PM    <DIR>          back_fs2004
11/13/2005  02:36 PM    <DIR>          fs2002
11/16/2006  09:01 AM    <DIR>          fs2004
02/13/2006  09:27 AM    <DIR>          fs2004_scenery
11/12/2006  02:02 PM    <DIR>          FSX_GmaxGamePack

Within the FSX_GmasGamePack you will see the following:

Code:
Directory of C:\gmax\gamepacks\FSX_GmaxGamePack

03/02/2007  11:39 AM    <DIR>          .
03/02/2007  11:39 AM    <DIR>          ..
03/01/2007  05:07 PM               324 abrowser.cfg
11/01/2006  11:00 PM             1,418 FSX_GMax.lnk
03/02/2007  11:13 AM             5,714 gmax.ini
11/01/2006  11:00 PM               133 plugin.ini
01/05/2007  02:42 PM    <DIR>          Plugins
02/07/2007  09:30 AM    <DIR>          scenes
11/10/2006  08:27 PM    <DIR>          scripts
01/16/2007  11:39 AM    <DIR>          textures

All you need to do here is rightclick on the FSX_GMax.lnk file, and SendTo Desktop as Shortcut. Alternatively, you can drag-n-drop the file to your Desktop.

From now on, if you want to work with FSX modeling, simply start GMax using this new shortcut! If you want to work with FS2004 modeling, start GMax using the original shortcut. It truly is that simple... :)

2) Now, the next thing to look at is the SDK document titled: new aircraft procedures.html. Assuming that you are already familiar with the FS2004 methods, reading this very well written SDK should make the new procedures transparent.

One of the major differences is that the exterior and interior models are now two completely seperate .mdl files, so of course they are exported and compiled seperately!

If you have an exiting FS9 model that used the "exterior" and "interior" node heirarchy structure, you can simply "hide" whichever parts are associated with the "interior" model structure, and then "Select All" visible parts (all the parts under "exterior" node), and then Export Selected as "Flightsim Model (*MDL)"... Unless you've added other export types, there should only be one other choice available: "Flightsim Cloud (*CLD)... :eek:

3) Another major change is in the area of Animations. All animations must be keyframed; "stock animations" that existed in FS9 are no longer available, such as l_flaps, etc. The SDK is quite detailed on how to use the new Animation Tool, which should appear on the top toolbar of GMax under the heading "FS Tools."

There is a chance that the new toolbar entry might not appear when loading GMax. In suce cases, click on "MAXScript\Run Script" then choose the "FSToolsMenu.ms" script from the browse window, then click on "Open." This should load the FSX Tools menu.

4) The next major change is in the area of Materials & Textures. You need to make a decision as to whether you wish to use the new features that are offered by FSX Materials, or simply leave the existing ones as-is.

FSX is perfectly capable of using the existing Standard Materials and FS9 compatible textures. Some adjustments in the Material's properties, such as Specular Level might need adjusting, but otherwise they work pretty well.

If you wish to convert the entire model to "true FSX compliance" however, you will need to create new "FSX Materials" for each of the existing Standard Textures. It's a bit of work, but the results are spectacular!

The simplest method I've found is to determine a starting point, then proceed methodically through the model's parts one-by-one until done. As as obvious starting point, the exterior fuselage would be my choice.

To get started, Select all the parts under the "interior" node, right click on the Viewport and choose "Freeze Selected." Put a checkmark in the "Hide Frozen Objects" box so they disappear from view.

Next, select the "fuselage" object, then click on Invert Selection to highlight everything except the "fuselage" object. Now rightclick in Viewport and choose "Hide Selection." You should now have only the fuselage visible.

Next, with the fuselage object selected, open the Material Navigator (upper right icon of three RGB balls). Check off "Browse From/Scene/Selected" so that only the Material assigned to the fuselage object appears.

Open the Material Editor by click on the "Red Cueball" icon, then click on "New." This should open a picklist where you can choose the type of Material you want. Choose "FlightSimX" and an empty Material dialog will be created. Now, simply drag-n-drop the texture file name from the Material Navigator window onto the "Diffuse Color" slot in the new FSX Material.

HINT: While at this point, it is a "good idea" name your new FSX Material for easy identification later. I use a naming scheme like this:

projectname_FSX_texturemapname - something like this:

CJ1_FSX_Fuselage


Now, click on Apply and watch the as the Material Navigator's display changes to show that the new FSX Material is assigned to your fuselage object! ;)

Since you've converted the Material to use the FSX Material type, you will need to make the necessary adjustments to the various dialogs in the Material Editor as outlined in the document I referred you to above.

In FSX itself, you will need to "convert" the existing fuselage.bmp file to the new .DDS format. If you use Imagetool (the new version supplied in the SDK) it will automatically "flip the texture vertically" for you. If you use Martin Wright's DXTBMP.exe program, you will need to "Flip Vertically" manually before Saving As DDS/DXT5 format.

The important point is that each part must be examined seperately, and if needed, create a new FSX Material for each new Material. Eventually, you will have converted all the existing Materials, in which case it will simply be a matter of choosing the correct FSX Material from the Material Navigator (which is why proper "naming" is important!), and click "Apply" to change the assignment on the selected part.

It's beyond the scope of this brief description to get into further details, but this should be enough to get you started at least!
 
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Oh yes. I should have mentioned that while this is indeed a very nice site and helpful resource, it is mostly populated by the more "advanced folks."

An excellent site dedicated to the more mundane (like myself!) may be found here: http://www.freeflightdesign.com/

There you will find excellent tutorials, tips and a forum full of help for all aspects of FS, populated by many of the best "freeware" developers, as well as rank beginners... :cool:
 
Certainly, I had never thought what I was getting into when I started. Had I known, I would probably have found a high tower and jumped. Let's just say that FS development involves a certain investigative side akin to Sherlock Holmes, and you need to have to go through a rite of passage. Then again, I find this challenging, therefore, of interest.

Arguably, some, will want you to go through the same kind of pain they went through, but thankfully, the goal of this wonderful site is certainly not that. Hopefully the posts you read around here will be helpful. As Bill says, we're here to help, and further this hobby of ours.

Etienne
 
Oh yes. I should have mentioned that while this is indeed a very nice site and helpful resource, it is mostly populated by the more "advanced folks."

An excellent site dedicated to the more mundane (like myself!) may be found here: http://www.freeflightdesign.com/

There you will find excellent tutorials, tips and a forum full of help for all aspects of FS, populated by many of the best "freeware" developers, as well as rank beginners... :cool:

I DID so take a shower today - I do not RANK!!
 
N4gix -

Thank you sir.

You gave me a bit of info I'm already familiar with, but I did read and confirm I'm doing the basics right, as well. Much appreciated.

My endeavors with "aircraft" are only ai boats. Interiors, panels, flight characteristics, etc, are way beyond my abilities; what level is below rank amature?

So far I've only exported it as a scenery object to verify textures, LOD's, etc. Next is an actual aircraft so I can set up contact points, effects, animations, etc.

From what you said, the same model I used to create the scenery object should work as a flyable aircraft, so I'm doing something wrong in the cfg files. I'll try to figure out what I've done wrong there.

I will check out the link you gave, was not aware of it.
 

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N4gix -

Thank you sir.

You gave me a bit of info I'm already familiar with, but I did read and confirm I'm doing the basics right, as well. Much appreciated.

My endeavors with "aircraft" are only ai boats. Interiors, panels, flight characteristics, etc, are way beyond my abilities; what level is below rank amature?

So far I've only exported it as a scenery object to verify textures, LOD's, etc. Next is an actual aircraft so I can set up contact points, effects, animations, etc.

From what you said, the same model I used to create the scenery object should work as a flyable aircraft, so I'm doing something wrong in the cfg files. I'll try to figure out what I've done wrong there.

I will check out the link you gave, was not aware of it.

You are most welcome. The name is Bill, BTW. N4GIX is my amateur radio callsign, and - since there are millions of "Bills" in the world, but only ONE "N4GIX," - I find it a useful forum name. I certainly have no desire to be known as "bill013945" just to register at a forum! :eek:

Oddly enough, I tend to work the other way with scenery objects, especially for FSX. I export a scenery object as an "aircraft model" first, and use a special "aircraft folder structure" so I can quickly load the "scenery/aircraft" and examine it in the sim! :cool:

Doing it this way has the obvious advantages of "slew mode" so I can "fly my scenery object(s)" around and view the object from every angle quickly. It also allows me to "place the object" in-situ, to see how it will 'blend in' with the existing scenery, terrain and ground textures.

That's a very nice looking AI "boat" you've shown in the screenie! :D
 
Nice repost of the SDK Bill :p

You're pulling my leg, right? I can assure you that my synopsis is considerably better organized, if not as complete... :p

Besides, I try to write in proper English, not pseudo techo-babble... :duck:
 
You're pulling my leg, right? I can assure you that my synopsis is considerably better organized, if not as complete... :p

Besides, I try to write in proper English, not pseudo techo-babble... :duck:


er... that's "techNo-babble..


:D
 
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