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need help with convering repaint dds to obj
- Thread starter saadoon
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Hi !
A) Get the source files :
1) you ask for permission from the original author if he/she is willing to provide you the source files and an agreement on what you can and cannot do
2) it is assumed you know how to adapt the design in order to be able to export to XP11, there are topics here and on the internet for that
3) When you release the conversion, you provide the terms of the agreement and credit the original author(s)
B) You don't have the source files :
1) you ask for permission from the original author if he/she is granting the permission to proceed on the conversion, and an agreement on what you can and cannot do
2) you post a topic (here for instance) and you explain the terms of the agreement
3) if someone who have the knowledge (I don't fully understand the process) and the tools (some of them are no longer available) is hiped by the objective (it's not always the case), he/she would help, providing the agreement is okay and the original author is always aware on time of what is currently done to/with his/her work.
4) Upon release, you provide the terms of the agreement and credit the original author(s).
5) If everything goes according to our philosophy in the communitiy (from as early as 1990 to this day) of contributors, especially on the fair use aspect (which have experienced many changes over the years, this, to protect the future of our hobby), you may benefit by learning the process of conversion, and even understand there are still a couple ways to achieve it). BTW, this can be discussed, and occur while in the process of converting.
C) You don't have permission/the original author doesn't answer.
1) You pick another aircraft from another creator and do A) or B)
2) If no option left, well, you're out of luck, like maybe create an entire aircraft from scratch... (this, if you want to remain on the "bright side").
D) You may find a way to reunite/retrieve/reassemble the set of tools to be able to do the conversion on your own. After all, it's all about files... Noone can prevent you from doing this, and personnaly, I think it's irrelevant as long as you don't release anything, not even your buddy who asks you "give it to me ! give it to me tooooo !".
What usually happens is you give it to someone, and he posts screenshots on Facebook and other people starts to ask for it, or, you decide to release the thing for XPlane without the consent of the original author yourself. That's the dark side. What's the problem one would say if it's free. Well, one hundred reasons.. Here are a few :
- XPlane and (MS)FS has some "features mismatches", when a creator makes a content, he does it with passion and overcomes the platform limitation by finding workarounds. If you are only doing a straightforward port, there are always things that won't work. Basically, you render meaningless the hundreds if not thousand of work by the original author.
- Releases of the kind often fail to credit the original author. Basically, people believe you made the thing, not the original author. That has a name : theft.
- Even if you credit the original author, how about everyone taking others work and make changes without permission, even if it's free ? Sounds great... until you start to become an actual creator yourself, you understand creating is not as easy as you thought, you must sacrifice part of your life (family, work, responsibilities..) to come up with something incredible. Despite being free, the value of the sacrifices involved translates into ownership, license and control over the creation. That's what credit and copyright mean : there is someone who worked hard to create this : that thing has a value, you just don't use it like if it was garbage.
(...)
- then, the original author gets demotivated, quit the hobby to concentrate on happinness (remember the sacrifices).. One disappointed creator, not a big deal ? Well, when I look of the thousands of topics asking if someone is willing to model this or that or if there is any particular project in the works, or how many airports are missing a decent to outstanding rendition.... well, maybe not loosing all those (freeware) creators along the years could have helped.
- some others have found an alternative : go full payware, make a solid licensing model through secured identification and payment, at least, if it's stolen on some obscure torrent in russian, I get a few bucks to buy me a beer, and let authorities handle the thing (not that I expect anything). Now you understand why we have less and less standalone installers anymore, you go through an identification platform first, so it is possible to track who leaked an illegally modified copyrighted material. As time goes by and network regulations gets more authority, we would be able to legally track those thieves and at least lock them out of the sector, eventually, even give him/her a hard life in the real world.
Note : we lose a chunck of freeware contributors each year for those reasons. Creators are not egoïsts monsters who are happy to only have a thing on MSFS and troll XPlane community (or the other way around). They are artists, and artists have an aspect of their personnality in common : a great sense of humanity. Just ask, if you get successfully in touch, you'll likely get permission. The exception I know of is the original author bound to some sort of exclusivity agreement with a brand or a platform. He/she would explain...
------
This big blah blah is not a lecture. It's to educate/explain, could be innappropriate for some, or too long, on point for others, there is no universal way to explain something, I do put everything in one place to reduce misinterpretations (there will be misinterpretations).
I am not telling you are about to do something fishy, I'm not accusing you of anything. You asked for help in converting (MS)FS to XPlane, at this point, many of us have tried, I did, out of curiosity (but since I don't have XPlane...) It's only on your computer, it's fine. Noone knows about, it's fine.
I'm just answering the question, but due to the sensible aspect of the thing, some clarifications are mandatory : where's the written permission ? (It should be publicly written somewhere anyone can check for free)
The blah blah is the explanation why it matters, the permission being the condition before getting further. I don't expect anyone here to tell you on the fly the process despite many knowing it. Most people won't have the time to write all this, they will just not answer because they are also waiting for the agreement from the original author. Then, this is not the place to explain the process, the relucancy to share it is real as of today. That's not a question you ask for everyone to see (but it's okay to ask, just the answer addresses a concern you didn't expected). Now you know the way to go :
- you provide all the clarifications required on the situation
- someone willing to help contacts you
- you work with that person and the original author(s).
^^ That, at least is how it is for those who are here and related platforms. Elsewere, probably not.
Side note :
You said "DDS aircraft repaints to OBJ". I think you meant "PBR models to OBJ". "DDS" and "repaints" are misleading : to modify PBR textures only, ie the texture file (those who have depth and normal information) this is done in a raster graphic application such as Photoshop or similar. The model has to be designed to use PBR materials in the model file. Those are two separate part of the feature and are addressed separately.
Best regards.
A) Get the source files :
1) you ask for permission from the original author if he/she is willing to provide you the source files and an agreement on what you can and cannot do
2) it is assumed you know how to adapt the design in order to be able to export to XP11, there are topics here and on the internet for that
3) When you release the conversion, you provide the terms of the agreement and credit the original author(s)
B) You don't have the source files :
1) you ask for permission from the original author if he/she is granting the permission to proceed on the conversion, and an agreement on what you can and cannot do
2) you post a topic (here for instance) and you explain the terms of the agreement
3) if someone who have the knowledge (I don't fully understand the process) and the tools (some of them are no longer available) is hiped by the objective (it's not always the case), he/she would help, providing the agreement is okay and the original author is always aware on time of what is currently done to/with his/her work.
4) Upon release, you provide the terms of the agreement and credit the original author(s).
5) If everything goes according to our philosophy in the communitiy (from as early as 1990 to this day) of contributors, especially on the fair use aspect (which have experienced many changes over the years, this, to protect the future of our hobby), you may benefit by learning the process of conversion, and even understand there are still a couple ways to achieve it). BTW, this can be discussed, and occur while in the process of converting.
C) You don't have permission/the original author doesn't answer.
1) You pick another aircraft from another creator and do A) or B)
2) If no option left, well, you're out of luck, like maybe create an entire aircraft from scratch... (this, if you want to remain on the "bright side").
D) You may find a way to reunite/retrieve/reassemble the set of tools to be able to do the conversion on your own. After all, it's all about files... Noone can prevent you from doing this, and personnaly, I think it's irrelevant as long as you don't release anything, not even your buddy who asks you "give it to me ! give it to me tooooo !".
What usually happens is you give it to someone, and he posts screenshots on Facebook and other people starts to ask for it, or, you decide to release the thing for XPlane without the consent of the original author yourself. That's the dark side. What's the problem one would say if it's free. Well, one hundred reasons.. Here are a few :
- XPlane and (MS)FS has some "features mismatches", when a creator makes a content, he does it with passion and overcomes the platform limitation by finding workarounds. If you are only doing a straightforward port, there are always things that won't work. Basically, you render meaningless the hundreds if not thousand of work by the original author.
- Releases of the kind often fail to credit the original author. Basically, people believe you made the thing, not the original author. That has a name : theft.
- Even if you credit the original author, how about everyone taking others work and make changes without permission, even if it's free ? Sounds great... until you start to become an actual creator yourself, you understand creating is not as easy as you thought, you must sacrifice part of your life (family, work, responsibilities..) to come up with something incredible. Despite being free, the value of the sacrifices involved translates into ownership, license and control over the creation. That's what credit and copyright mean : there is someone who worked hard to create this : that thing has a value, you just don't use it like if it was garbage.
(...)
- then, the original author gets demotivated, quit the hobby to concentrate on happinness (remember the sacrifices).. One disappointed creator, not a big deal ? Well, when I look of the thousands of topics asking if someone is willing to model this or that or if there is any particular project in the works, or how many airports are missing a decent to outstanding rendition.... well, maybe not loosing all those (freeware) creators along the years could have helped.
- some others have found an alternative : go full payware, make a solid licensing model through secured identification and payment, at least, if it's stolen on some obscure torrent in russian, I get a few bucks to buy me a beer, and let authorities handle the thing (not that I expect anything). Now you understand why we have less and less standalone installers anymore, you go through an identification platform first, so it is possible to track who leaked an illegally modified copyrighted material. As time goes by and network regulations gets more authority, we would be able to legally track those thieves and at least lock them out of the sector, eventually, even give him/her a hard life in the real world.
Note : we lose a chunck of freeware contributors each year for those reasons. Creators are not egoïsts monsters who are happy to only have a thing on MSFS and troll XPlane community (or the other way around). They are artists, and artists have an aspect of their personnality in common : a great sense of humanity. Just ask, if you get successfully in touch, you'll likely get permission. The exception I know of is the original author bound to some sort of exclusivity agreement with a brand or a platform. He/she would explain...
------
This big blah blah is not a lecture. It's to educate/explain, could be innappropriate for some, or too long, on point for others, there is no universal way to explain something, I do put everything in one place to reduce misinterpretations (there will be misinterpretations).
I am not telling you are about to do something fishy, I'm not accusing you of anything. You asked for help in converting (MS)FS to XPlane, at this point, many of us have tried, I did, out of curiosity (but since I don't have XPlane...) It's only on your computer, it's fine. Noone knows about, it's fine.
I'm just answering the question, but due to the sensible aspect of the thing, some clarifications are mandatory : where's the written permission ? (It should be publicly written somewhere anyone can check for free)
The blah blah is the explanation why it matters, the permission being the condition before getting further. I don't expect anyone here to tell you on the fly the process despite many knowing it. Most people won't have the time to write all this, they will just not answer because they are also waiting for the agreement from the original author. Then, this is not the place to explain the process, the relucancy to share it is real as of today. That's not a question you ask for everyone to see (but it's okay to ask, just the answer addresses a concern you didn't expected). Now you know the way to go :
- you provide all the clarifications required on the situation
- someone willing to help contacts you
- you work with that person and the original author(s).
^^ That, at least is how it is for those who are here and related platforms. Elsewere, probably not.
Side note :
You said "DDS aircraft repaints to OBJ". I think you meant "PBR models to OBJ". "DDS" and "repaints" are misleading : to modify PBR textures only, ie the texture file (those who have depth and normal information) this is done in a raster graphic application such as Photoshop or similar. The model has to be designed to use PBR materials in the model file. Those are two separate part of the feature and are addressed separately.
Best regards.
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Convert DDS to OBJ???
- DDS is a raster image saved in the DirectDraw Surface (DDS) container format
- OBJ is a simple data-format that represents 3D geometry alone
=rk=
Resource contributor
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What kind of a "resource" is this place? Has any of us ever heard the expression, "if you don't know, don't say?" The OP is obviously uncertain of his terms and probably authority, I'll be surprised if he posts again, WTG everyone. Granted, it isn't "our" sim we failed to nurture growth for, but still.
Xplane models are stored in .obj format and they call standard textures. "Convert .mdl to .obj, with Xp11 characteristics," would have been the semantically correct inquiry and even though I've never used XP11, I've read enough FSDeveloper forum posts, to know this much about it.
Xplane models are stored in .obj format and they call standard textures. "Convert .mdl to .obj, with Xp11 characteristics," would have been the semantically correct inquiry and even though I've never used XP11, I've read enough FSDeveloper forum posts, to know this much about it.
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- 110
- Country
I deeply wish OP is currently asking said permission, get it, and come back, so we can fully and openly support his steps in the hobby.
OP is asking us to explain how to decompile a PBR P3D *.mdl model in some sort of source file, or set of source files for that matter as it would include interior model, gauges, XML animation codes and eventually effects providing the list of softwares and manipulations samples required to conduct the decompilation, plus the set of softwares and manipulations to commit edits (if required, probably very much required), like Blender for the 3D software in order to translate the FS features into XPlane features, like if you have a PBR model from FS, what you need to do on the textures and the OBJ model properties and export options in order to have the PBR information when loaded in XPlane aswell. (I jump directly from "DDS" = FSX to PBR = P3d/MSFS because it is likely OP thinks DDS = PBR)
= "convert DDS aircraft repaints to OBJ" (roughly)
That's how I understood what the question was, hence my answer above.
I don't know the kind of copyright binding the aircraft he want to port to XPlane, if it's freeware or payware (not that makes any difference, but serves as an indicator beforehand of the the chances to get the permission to do so), and if he is planning this for a single occurrence or multiple addons (ie, you could do it for pretty much anything when you know the process)
OP is asking us to explain how to decompile a PBR P3D *.mdl model in some sort of source file, or set of source files for that matter as it would include interior model, gauges, XML animation codes and eventually effects providing the list of softwares and manipulations samples required to conduct the decompilation, plus the set of softwares and manipulations to commit edits (if required, probably very much required), like Blender for the 3D software in order to translate the FS features into XPlane features, like if you have a PBR model from FS, what you need to do on the textures and the OBJ model properties and export options in order to have the PBR information when loaded in XPlane aswell. (I jump directly from "DDS" = FSX to PBR = P3d/MSFS because it is likely OP thinks DDS = PBR)
= "convert DDS aircraft repaints to OBJ" (roughly)
That's how I understood what the question was, hence my answer above.
I don't know the kind of copyright binding the aircraft he want to port to XPlane, if it's freeware or payware (not that makes any difference, but serves as an indicator beforehand of the the chances to get the permission to do so), and if he is planning this for a single occurrence or multiple addons (ie, you could do it for pretty much anything when you know the process)
A few stories :
Somewhere around 2005-2006, I publicly asked on the AIAardvark forum (dead) if someone were interrested in better looking AI models mapped with AI Aardvark textures (posted 2 screenshots of the WIP). I expected a "yeah, go on" from the board, I was told to ask permission to David Rawlins (and related paintkitter). So I asked and got no answer. I didn't pursue in developping those models, with a slight anger... til I understood the meaning of the thing a couple years later and the following occurences of using one's material to make something else. I didn't knew, I was among those who believed "it's free, I can do without explicit permission as long as it remains free". Reality : That's not how it works ! It took me several years to learn it, here, I'm trying to explain it all in one go.
I've made a scenery for FS9 in 2007, then got sidetracked by life concerns. I had plans to upgrade it to FSX (and so on), but turned out some people out there ported it to FSX already (AvsimRus, some Facebook groups, other "obscure" file resources). Each port has missing features, bad textures, bad lightings.. Noone asked me for the source files (I would have gladly provided them), and I didn't see the point in updating something to a sim if people were already (relatively) enjoying the ports despite their drawbacks. This is the case, despite me having the materials to make better upgrades and compatible feature for said sim, not doing so : no motivation.
This is not to make OP feel bad, but actually, there is no way around, I pretty much understand how he may feel and why he may never post again, I just wished someone explained similar concerns for the rookie I was back then.
That permission thing... maybe I'm siding Hiroshi Igami principles so much (his models has been decompiled numerous times without his consent then converted), as well as AI Traffic models sets as monitored over Alpha India Group with the Morten AI packages, ICE AI packages (and their later variants), and the UTT drama of flyable models converted in low poly for AI (some of them from payware stuff, that modeler even put his source files on some 3D payware platform resources). FSPainter (Mitsushi Yutaka) made several puplic statements (Facebook) why he became payware and beside the main reason (life), he made clear he was fed up of people stealing his models. There was also a french drama about a WIP FSX/P3D Mirage 2000 abandonned involving an illegal XPlane port.
By explaning what is asked, and not advising beforehand how it works, we are - I think - just opening another can of worms, but that's just an opinion, I'm in no position to talk in place of an entire community. However, I believe it is better to share the situation to the public, why that permission thing is a pillar many believe to be (including me), because there is no other people out there able to do so.
This resource platform is also a knowledge base, almost everything the OP wants to know is already here, given some researches (and I'm against removing those resources). Once you know how to proceed, you can repeat the process as many times as you wish, on any FS/P3d creation you want to port to XPlane and much more. The process is not a problem (here I plainly disagree with many guys in the little story), but it is very important anyone is aware of the permission condition from the original author.
I deeply wish OP is currently asking said permission, get it, and come back, so we can fully and openly support his steps in the hobby.
Somewhere around 2005-2006, I publicly asked on the AIAardvark forum (dead) if someone were interrested in better looking AI models mapped with AI Aardvark textures (posted 2 screenshots of the WIP). I expected a "yeah, go on" from the board, I was told to ask permission to David Rawlins (and related paintkitter). So I asked and got no answer. I didn't pursue in developping those models, with a slight anger... til I understood the meaning of the thing a couple years later and the following occurences of using one's material to make something else. I didn't knew, I was among those who believed "it's free, I can do without explicit permission as long as it remains free". Reality : That's not how it works ! It took me several years to learn it, here, I'm trying to explain it all in one go.
I've made a scenery for FS9 in 2007, then got sidetracked by life concerns. I had plans to upgrade it to FSX (and so on), but turned out some people out there ported it to FSX already (AvsimRus, some Facebook groups, other "obscure" file resources). Each port has missing features, bad textures, bad lightings.. Noone asked me for the source files (I would have gladly provided them), and I didn't see the point in updating something to a sim if people were already (relatively) enjoying the ports despite their drawbacks. This is the case, despite me having the materials to make better upgrades and compatible feature for said sim, not doing so : no motivation.
This is not to make OP feel bad, but actually, there is no way around, I pretty much understand how he may feel and why he may never post again, I just wished someone explained similar concerns for the rookie I was back then.
That permission thing... maybe I'm siding Hiroshi Igami principles so much (his models has been decompiled numerous times without his consent then converted), as well as AI Traffic models sets as monitored over Alpha India Group with the Morten AI packages, ICE AI packages (and their later variants), and the UTT drama of flyable models converted in low poly for AI (some of them from payware stuff, that modeler even put his source files on some 3D payware platform resources). FSPainter (Mitsushi Yutaka) made several puplic statements (Facebook) why he became payware and beside the main reason (life), he made clear he was fed up of people stealing his models. There was also a french drama about a WIP FSX/P3D Mirage 2000 abandonned involving an illegal XPlane port.
By explaning what is asked, and not advising beforehand how it works, we are - I think - just opening another can of worms, but that's just an opinion, I'm in no position to talk in place of an entire community. However, I believe it is better to share the situation to the public, why that permission thing is a pillar many believe to be (including me), because there is no other people out there able to do so.
This resource platform is also a knowledge base, almost everything the OP wants to know is already here, given some researches (and I'm against removing those resources). Once you know how to proceed, you can repeat the process as many times as you wish, on any FS/P3d creation you want to port to XPlane and much more. The process is not a problem (here I plainly disagree with many guys in the little story), but it is very important anyone is aware of the permission condition from the original author.
I deeply wish OP is currently asking said permission, get it, and come back, so we can fully and openly support his steps in the hobby.
Last edited:
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FSDeveloper does not entertain threads or extensive postings about copyright issues. It has been stated many times: members should seek legal advice from an attorney or copyright specialist. Legal advice, whether solicited or opined can lead to compromising positions for both members and FSDeveloper.
I am closing this thread.
I am closing this thread.