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Please get me going.

  • Thread starter Thread starter george7378
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george7378

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Hi all,

I can model straight-forward things in Gmax, like buildings, but when it comes to aircraft or figures, basically anything that isn't square, then I just don't know where to start. I just make a cylinder, or sphere, and end up pulling verticies or sides about, and ending up with a mess that looks nothing like it should. I just don't know what to put where. Any tips on how I can create a simple aircraft? Where do you start when you make a plane?

Thankyou very much.
 
There are several (very basic) modelling tutorials available...

Look for "Stupid IDiot's Guide to MAking An airplane". While it's for FS2004, at least it points you in the right direction.

Check out the tutorials at FFDS (http://www.freeflightdesign.com) for a couple of other basic modelling tutorials

Also, do not forget the (in)famous "P-38" tutorial included in the gmax tutorials.
 
Thanks - I had a look.

I really want to know what tools you use in Gmax - what features you use. For instance, there must be a way to a nose cone, without creating a cylinder, and having to pull each vertex into place manually. I can create a profile of something using one viewport, for instance left, but then, everything becomes a mess when I try to the front of the plane. What can I do? How do you take full advantage of Gmax's tools?
 
How to make an aeroplane

Hi,

I am attaching a gmax file of a very, very simple aeroplane for you to mess with.

You are asking the 64 dollar question for beginner users of gmax. Making things with gmax isn't easy.

Making good aeroplanes with gmax is actually very hard. I can barely make things that are very simple, and many people are like me. So, don't be discouraged. It does require some "talent", but it requires a lot of practice, too.

Here are some sugestions:

* Start with a long box for fuselage, flat box for wings, cylinder for wheels, etc.

* Try to export it and fly it.

* After that, try the house tutorial. I know it is all blocks, but it will give you a pretty good handle on how tom move vertices around.

* For working with vertices and the rest of the basic gmax tools, the tuturial for building the house is pretty good. The plane tutorial P38 is more complicated, and you should graduate the "moving vertices around" level first.

(I don't know what you mean by "figures", but if you mean a person or a head or a pilot, that is the holy grail of modeling, so, try to get one already done.)

* Have a look at this gmax file attached. It is an aeroplane with a few of the major parts, very simple, and perhaps you can see the fundamentals and go more complex after that. Save the original and mess with a copy.

Don't hesitate to ask more questions. That is what a forum is for.

I'd say also

* Never get the vertices too close to each other so you can't see exactly where they are. If a vertice "crosses the line" it will give you export erros nearly impossible to figure out.

* Use Zoom In all the time to make sure you are not crossing lines and that you can see details.

* But zoom out frequently so you can see "the big picture".

* Move vertices together when possible, in pairs or in groups to maintain symetry and consisency.

* Use the Scale toll when you can, rather than move the vertices one by one.

* When you use scale, make sure you use Uniform Scale or Non-Uniform Scale to change the sizes of the parts.

* When using Scale, as when using any of the other tools, make sure you look at all four views to see where your vertices are going.

* Don't forget to use "Ignore Backfacing" when selecting vertices. When checked, if there is a vertice showing but more vertices behind it (frequently happens), the tool you are using will only affect the first one. When unchecked, the first one AND the ones hidden behind it will be affected together.

* Use Edit > Clone to create parts that are identical, such as creating one wing and cloning it to make the other.

The list of tricks is way too long, so I am afraid you will have to ask a few questions at a time, after you have done the tutorials. gmax has many tools and it is impossible to tell you "how to make an aeroplane".

The only way is to do the tutorials, keep trying, asking questions.

The P38 tutorial is complicated OK, and perhaps you should have a look at it after you look at this gmax file. The way it is the plane will fly backwards, though.

Let us know how you did.

Fern
 

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Thanks very much,

It is always nice when a guru like you gets a newbie up and running.
 
Hi again,

I took your advice, and practiced using verticies. I made my own simple plane (below), and I hope to move on further.

So basically, all Gmax objects are made by moving verticies, and there are no other methods involved?

Thanks for all your help!
 

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OF course there are other "methods" ...

You can select and move groups of vertices, scale etc.

THere are mmodifiers you can apply to objects.

Have you gone through the tutorials that come with (although they are a separate install) gmax? That would give us a better feel to how familiar you are overall with gmax.

For example, your wing could be a scaled cylinder, but then you can add a taper modifier.

Or, you can create your cross sections and attach them, then add a cross section and surface modifiers.

You can create a loft object ....

etc etc

I guess that, in order to help you more, we need to know "where" you are with gmax, so that we can be comfortable we're on common ground.
 
I have done most of the tutorials, and I have made some detailed scenery. What I am really trying to do, is assess which functions of Gmax I need to make an aircraft - basically, something that involes shaping a curved fuselage from front, back and left.
So, I can use modifiers, editable poly functions, and cut and extrude, and scaling up or down.

I'm not quite sure what a loft object is though.
 
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OK, thanks for the advice. I found that scaling about 3-4 columns of verticies creates a pretty smooth curve for a nose of an aircraft. I guess I will learn a lot through experimenting!
 
Hi again,

I have made a bit more progress with my simple aircraft. Pictures are included. Am I doing well? Is there anything else you think I could do to it?

Thanks very much.
 

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Hey George,


I compare Gmax (and Max) with a game of Chess at times.. Its tactical. Some shapes are best started from a cylinder or Sphere. Some (like a control stick or landing gear strut) are best done from a Spline treated with Lathe (spins it into a rotary shape).

Then there are times that a shape is best or easiest made from a set of Splines, all combined (Attached in order front to back) and then add a Cross Section and then Surface modifiers to make it a solid object.

If going the last one, only do half of the side at a time.

Another way, which is explained in the tutorial when making a half face, is to start with a basic 'clump' and add a Mesh Smooth with about 1 or 2 Iterations (levels of smoothness enhancement to the Mesh). But, dont collapse the stack. Instead, keep working with the 'base' clump! It makes it much easier and especially if its only one side. (You can make a quick clone and mirror it to see both sides, but then delete it and carry on with the original side).

Note; when skinning a Spline Mesh, in the Surface modifier, use 0.0 for the Surface tension or noise setting, and probably 0 or 1 for the Iterations level. You may also have to select "Flip Polygon Normals" if its inside out for some reason.


Here are some screenshots of planes I have done. First one is recent, made from a basic clump, then 2 Iterations of Mesh Smooth is added.

The second one was made with Splines. I bent and stretched and tortured each Spline till they were what I felt the shape should be. I then attached them all (in another build up) and then skinned them, then continued to bend and modify the shape until it was what I thought as good as possible.



One last thing, I use 'Taper' but only on one axis at a time, like side view, then top view, then front view. I will usually collapse the stack to do the second and third (and fourth and fifth) Tapering. I taper the heck out of parts even if they are only done just a tiny bit, for me its important to be right on.. (I might have 7 hits of Taper on a side of a fuselage.. )


COMPOSITE

Scrshot3064-945x610.jpg

This is the 'clump' base part... Note its extreme simple shape...

Scrshot4394-945x605.jpg

This is the same shape with Mesh Smooth and 2 Iterations.

Scrshot3023-944x602.jpg


Scrshot2992-945x604.jpg




KODIAK

Scrshot242-945x717-944x724.jpg


Scrshot2472-945x716-944x722.jpg


Scrshot0244-940x714-945x728.jpg




Note; That scoop is very difficult (for me) to do, at least back then. Now, I combine two parts, then attach the scoop assembly to the fuselage, and weld in the vertices, making vertice attach points in the fuselage, then blending and then adding "Smooth" (not a Mesh Smooth, but simple 'visual' Smooth).



Bill
 
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Thanks mate,

I'm new to the idea of splines - I will experiment with them tomorrow. To make the aircraft above, I just created some primitives, added segments, moved the outside verticies into an plane-ish shape, and scaled, and added meshsmooth. I also began animating.

Aside from splines, I still need to know:

How to cut out control surfaces.
Are final animations done in Gmax, or something else?
Plus a couple of small things, as they arise.

Thanks!
 
Hey George,

To cut out control surfaces (or doors or windows, etc), just highlight Polygons in Polygon mode, then right click and select "Detach".

Animation is done in Gmax. The ruler looking thing at the bottom of Gmax is the time/animation scaler. Just slide that and set a animation point, and move the part (with Animation mode on/animation mode button selected to 'on' mode). Thus, a part (usually points zero and 100) will then move in those 2 point zones (zero and 100). A door for instance will be closed on point zero, and open on point 100. Ailerons are max one way at zero, neutral at 50, and maxed the other way at 100. Landing gear is moved (hinged when retracted) from zero to 100, and then suspension movement is from 100 to 200.



Bill
 
OK, thanks!

I'll do this on my prcatice model, and show you again tomorrow.
Then, maybe I can start a real aircraft!

Thanks again!
 
Hi all,

I have a few more questions:

1. When I detach the end of the wing, a big gap is left, like a slice into the wing. How can I fix this:

untitled.jpg


2. How do I ceate another polygon along the Y axis, so that I can create a smaller aileron? I have drawn where I would like it to be:

22.jpg


4. Also, how can I change the point about which an object pivots when I rotate it?

Thanks very much!
 
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Ah, I found that the 'slice plane' tool will allow me to cut the aileron. Experimenting really helps!
 
Hey George,

Yep, Slice Plane will cut it, but will have extra Vertices to deal with. Its fine if they dont annoy you. Otherwise, Detaching polygons directly works really well.


To change a pivot point, also known as moving the Gizmo, (crosshair), you simply go to 'Hierarchy' mode (far right command panel, white tab) and find Effect Gizmo (pivot) only, and then move the Giz into position. You can also rotate it, such as what Ailerons need when wings have dyhedral added.


To fill in openings left when cutting out ailerons and flaps, go to Polygon mode, click on Create, and click on the blue Vertices in a row in Anti-Clockwise direction all the way around until you are back to the point you started. I would do sides seperately, then the back.

If you create a poly clockwise, it will crash and not work or show up or will be backwards.

If you change your object (wing for instance) to a Editable Poly, then when you create Polygons, the Vertices will be made visible. In E-Mesh mode, they are hidden. You have to feel around for them with the Cursor.

On Ailerons, a quick tip is to extrude out the front of the aileron (or flap) and then chamfir it so that it looks rounded in the front edge. In the 'openings' of the wings themselves, I extrude that edge plug inward into the wing a short amount so that it is a cavity for the leading edge of the aileron/flap to fit into...



Bill
 
Thanks very much lionheart,

I was wondering - what other ways are there to smooth. Meshsmooth deforms my new fuselage too much.

Thanks!
 
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