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Which the release of FS2020 we see an explosition of activity on the forun and of course we are very happy to see this. But having all questions about FS2020 in one forum becomes a bit messy. So therefore we would like to ask you all to use the following guidelines when posting your questions:
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Prices going up and up... (rant alert)
- Thread starter Shaun
- Start date
I have had upwards to 100,000 downloads on my freeware stuff over the years and from a reliable, well known, payware developer a success for them is 2,000 sales, which would be about 2% of my freeware. So would this be realistic if the product was a hit?
Clutch[/QUOTE]
It is going to depend a number of things.
What may be accepted as an excellent model, freeware, will come under critical microscopic examination the second you charge $1. It's not difficult to achieve high download numbers if your product is free!
That dollar will immediately dismiss 90% of your "potential" market as comparably few actually invest in payware preferring to trawl the freeware grounds for their add-ons.
Larger developers and publishers have existing distribution networks in place to ensure some sort of volume. Would you have such a thing?
Your market needs to know you exist to be able to assess your product, let alone buy it. How much market awareness will you have for your product?
Assess your total projected revenue and compare against costs -remember that for things like sounds and gauge programming, you will no longer be able to rely on freeware, you must pay licenses and royalties to authors unless you can supply those things yourself. If you market yourself you'll need website costs, virtual checkout facilities, a product support/helpdesk system and allow for taxes in your financial computations.
If you go the royalty route to overcome distribution problems, then you are talking percentages of revenue from sales. Even if the product is a success you may not achieve more than a few hundred dollars over the life of the product.
Volume is the key. You must be prepared to produce several, complete, projects in a year to stand any chance of a worthwhile income.
As has been said, the world of payware really is a different planet to the one you are currently on. Go there by all means but be prepared to be disappointed.
Clutch[/QUOTE]
It is going to depend a number of things.
What may be accepted as an excellent model, freeware, will come under critical microscopic examination the second you charge $1. It's not difficult to achieve high download numbers if your product is free!
That dollar will immediately dismiss 90% of your "potential" market as comparably few actually invest in payware preferring to trawl the freeware grounds for their add-ons.
Larger developers and publishers have existing distribution networks in place to ensure some sort of volume. Would you have such a thing?
Your market needs to know you exist to be able to assess your product, let alone buy it. How much market awareness will you have for your product?
Assess your total projected revenue and compare against costs -remember that for things like sounds and gauge programming, you will no longer be able to rely on freeware, you must pay licenses and royalties to authors unless you can supply those things yourself. If you market yourself you'll need website costs, virtual checkout facilities, a product support/helpdesk system and allow for taxes in your financial computations.
If you go the royalty route to overcome distribution problems, then you are talking percentages of revenue from sales. Even if the product is a success you may not achieve more than a few hundred dollars over the life of the product.
Volume is the key. You must be prepared to produce several, complete, projects in a year to stand any chance of a worthwhile income.
As has been said, the world of payware really is a different planet to the one you are currently on. Go there by all means but be prepared to be disappointed.
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So, if such a disappointment on the returns why are all of you developing? 
So, if such a disappointment on the returns why are all of you developing?
Good question. Because it is fun and most have "day" jobs. Look, we've been doing this stuff for 12 years now, many have been doing it longer, so we've learned a lot from our mistakes and found ways through to make it work.
All I mean is that there is no simple answer. You MUST be prepared to be disappointed. To realise that if you turn "pro" your greatest supporters will immediately become your fiercest critics. You will be sent to the wilderness for a period until they can learn to trust you again.
Put your ego away for good and above all, realise that it is going to take a long time to reach any sort of success.
This is a VERY niche market. You will be fishing in a very small pond.
If you decide to make a "Blinko MkIII" make the best damned "Blinko MkIII" you can and go to market. But if the market just doesn't want a "Blinko MkIII" you will have wasted 4-5 months. Don't complain, swallow your mistake and begin another project.
Do that a few times and you'll have become a real "pro".
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I am a Blinko and I am suing you for your awful rendition of my beautiful arrangements 
Heretic
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"Will it have realistic systems?"
"I want a FMC!"
"Why no paint of [random airline]?"
"Can this be A2A quality?"
I'd make billions with a "punch people in the face over the internet" device. "WIP - web inyourface protocol" or so.
Or a Ground2Ground missile remote control. Open web site, enter target coordinates, click "launch", watch live feed.
"I want a FMC!"
"Why no paint of [random airline]?"
"Can this be A2A quality?"
I'd make billions with a "punch people in the face over the internet" device. "WIP - web inyourface protocol" or so.
Or a Ground2Ground missile remote control. Open web site, enter target coordinates, click "launch", watch live feed.
Heretic
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Nah, Silverlight. Heh.
I think hcornea has said it with its true colors.
I am also a developer and though not as hcornea I depend on this entirely for my only source of income!
Though I won't say who I am, wish to remain anonymous within these forums, I can say that it is very very hard that a great HD quality payware scenery sells 2000 copies in one year, perhaps not even 2 years. Back in the FS9 years 2002-2006 perhaps it was better. However now a days the only people buying are hardcore FS fans!
If you spend a year doing a mega airport to sell it at 22 euros, and you are lucky enough to get a return of sales in a year of lets say 1500 copies (which is to be very optimistic) you earn 33,000 euros. Which if you take a note of buying aerial photography etc and then paying the commission from the sim shop you are left with something in the order of less than 24,000 euros for your 1920 hours of work in a year (40 hours a week) that will be 12.50 euros an hour which is not a lot, considering you have people depending on you.
So this is not a speculative business, we are merely trying to get a slim return on our own work.
I am also a developer and though not as hcornea I depend on this entirely for my only source of income!
Though I won't say who I am, wish to remain anonymous within these forums, I can say that it is very very hard that a great HD quality payware scenery sells 2000 copies in one year, perhaps not even 2 years. Back in the FS9 years 2002-2006 perhaps it was better. However now a days the only people buying are hardcore FS fans!
If you spend a year doing a mega airport to sell it at 22 euros, and you are lucky enough to get a return of sales in a year of lets say 1500 copies (which is to be very optimistic) you earn 33,000 euros. Which if you take a note of buying aerial photography etc and then paying the commission from the sim shop you are left with something in the order of less than 24,000 euros for your 1920 hours of work in a year (40 hours a week) that will be 12.50 euros an hour which is not a lot, considering you have people depending on you.
So this is not a speculative business, we are merely trying to get a slim return on our own work.
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Oh my gosh... you guys are soooo funny 
I nearly spilled my morning 'cuppa Joe' from some of the comments. That's why I like coming down here. Good crowd.
No, I do understand freeware and payware are two completely different worlds. I guess what I was saying while you cannot expect returns like freeware it could be used as an indicator as to what are popular type add-ons and what are not.
And of course "my add-on" will be something everybody who sims will want, ha! Well, I guess that's why I am sticking just my toe in the water to see if too hot or too cold. Or do I have a thick enough skin for this. Or all my years in the professional world will help when it comes to the many hats one must wear when striking out on his own into the flightsim abyss.
I guess that is also a reason why so many amazing addons are done for free - just not worth the hassle from all those "nice simmers" out there (man we can be a rude bunch).
Anywho... love the customer comments.
thx,
Clutch
I nearly spilled my morning 'cuppa Joe' from some of the comments. That's why I like coming down here. Good crowd.No, I do understand freeware and payware are two completely different worlds. I guess what I was saying while you cannot expect returns like freeware it could be used as an indicator as to what are popular type add-ons and what are not.
And of course "my add-on" will be something everybody who sims will want, ha! Well, I guess that's why I am sticking just my toe in the water to see if too hot or too cold. Or do I have a thick enough skin for this. Or all my years in the professional world will help when it comes to the many hats one must wear when striking out on his own into the flightsim abyss.
I guess that is also a reason why so many amazing addons are done for free - just not worth the hassle from all those "nice simmers" out there (man we can be a rude bunch).
Anywho... love the customer comments.
thx,
Clutch
It's quite simple. Margins are tighter, piracy is more prevalent. Costs are higher. Everything goes up. Developers have the same living costs as we do.
I think there are far bigger issues like petrol, electricity, and insurance prices which are skyrocketing here compared to the issue of a few $20 FS addons per year that are now 25.
.
I think there are far bigger issues like petrol, electricity, and insurance prices which are skyrocketing here compared to the issue of a few $20 FS addons per year that are now 25.
.
The problem is, all those other costs, shrink the hobby budget, in effect making the 5 dollar price increase worse. Not a good time to be in the hobby market, I would believe.
btw. over here, petrol has been steady, even in a small decrease, over the last two to three years. Of course in the scope of three to four years before that, it went up almost 50%.
btw. over here, petrol has been steady, even in a small decrease, over the last two to three years. Of course in the scope of three to four years before that, it went up almost 50%.
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Clutch Cargo said " I guess that is also a reason why so many amazing addons are done for free - just not worth the hassle from all those "nice simmers" out there (man we can be a rude bunch). "
I agree with you 100%, I have done three or four Payware projects and am still convinced doing "freeware" is much more fun and more rewarding than a few dollars, Euros or whatever. Naturally I do this for fun at night after work. I have some new projects on my mind and will probably be freeware to really enjoy them.
I agree with you 100%, I have done three or four Payware projects and am still convinced doing "freeware" is much more fun and more rewarding than a few dollars, Euros or whatever. Naturally I do this for fun at night after work. I have some new projects on my mind and will probably be freeware to really enjoy them.
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Clutch Cargo said " I guess that is also a reason why so many amazing addons are done for free - just not worth the hassle from all those "nice simmers" out there (man we can be a rude bunch). "
I agree with you 100%, I have done three or four Payware projects and am still convinced doing "freeware" is much more fun and more rewarding than a few dollars, Euros or whatever. Naturally I do this for fun at night after work. I have some new projects on my mind and will probably be freeware to really enjoy them.
Generally the expectation of users if different for freeware (but not always in my experience). If you charge for something then you need to have a good way to support it; good documentation and so on. Free on the other hand should not bring with it the same obligations. However from my experience there are users who seem to expect the same level of support for free as for paid. Generally I find myself offering to refund what they paid for ADE if they are not satified
One of the worst I recall was someone who blamed ADE for deleting most of the addons in his FSX installation and insisting that I recompense him. Needless to say he could not articulate how ADE might have done this (other than he had read somewhere of a memory problem with 1,50.01 - fixed at once of course and internal to ADE). I still wonder how a program that is designed to create airports can delete or otherwise render addon aircraft unusable...
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Following Jon´s comment---I like to interact with people and I answer all inquiries, situations et all I get from users on both my freeware and payware stuff. When I get an "angry" e-mail which shows me that the user is totally out I usually tell him or her to do this or that and see if that worked for him....if he or her comes back again with out of line comments or really crazy stuff I simply delete the e-mail and forget it....luckily no such things have happened to my tiny Payware projects ( crossing fingers now) but some in the freeware stuff have had these situations. You can allways tell if the writer is just a new guy with the sim or one that is bunkers or just a nut...I guess that´s part of the "project"