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P3D v5 Take-off runways for Ai at EBBR

R

Ray Proudfoot

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unitedkingdom
I'm running P3Dv5.3HF2 and have lots of Ai provided by AIG. Everything works very well but I have a question regarding runways used by Ai.

I have JustSim EBBR and using ADE have changed the northerly 07L/25R to take-off only; 07R/25L to landing only and 01/19 to take-off only.

With winds of 240/13 I would have expected 25R to be used by departing Ai. But instead they're using 01. That seems illogical when 25R is closer to a headwind and it's also longer.

Is there any way to force Ai to use 25R or is it down to problems with the P3D code?
 
P3Dv5 is extremely reluctant to accept user input winds, so check that the wind you've input is actually the wind being used by the sim. If you input the wind during a session, it takes ages for the traffic to adapt to it as AI will use the runway allocated when the AI engine first becomes aware of that traffic. That can be up to 15 minutes ahead of the traffic appearing in the sim.
 
Hi Tim, I've just completed a flight from EGCC to EIDW. Winds at Dublin are 320/11 so 28L was the logical arrival runway. Despite that P3D sent Ai to 10R. Using Shift+Z winds in the sim are 322/11. So essentially the same.

Winds provided by ASP3D rather than manually in my EBBR test. This was a 35 min flight but weather was loaded for 15 mins prior to pushback whilst I setup the CDU. ADE confirms both ends of 10R/28L are okay for take-off and landing.

I guess I'll just have to live with it. Fortunately AiCompanion allows me to delete the taxi out Ai.
 
Ray, I've just tried the same situation at both EBBR and EIDW. I have only the P3Dv5.4 stock airfields, and EIDW lacks the new parallel runway. I'm also using AIG, plus UTLive v2 and MAIW traffic files. I managed to get it to launch with a wind of 240/10-18kts. Both airfields oriented the correct way, and EBBR used both runways for landing in the initial busy period, but settled down to mostly 25L for landing and 25R for take-off. I suspect that the issue is with the addon airfields, not P3D or the AI engine. I've seen this kind of stuff discussed on FSDev as far back as when Jim Vile was the resident AI expert, and I'm pretty sure he'd put it down to approach design. Obviously I don't have the JustSim EBBR, but it might be worth deleting the approaches included in the addon and importing the stock approaches - in general the P3Dv5 approaches are very close to reality. That said, the JustSim EBBR v2.1 is P3Dv5-specific, so I would have expected them to have included the updated approaches.
 
Tim Collins said:
I suspect that the issue is with the addon airfields, not P3D or the AI engine. I've seen this kind of stuff discussed on FSDev as far back as when Jim Vile was the resident AI expert, and I'm pretty sure he'd put it down to approach design. Obviously I don't have the JustSim EBBR, but it might be worth deleting the approaches included in the addon and importing the stock approaches
Click to expand...
Tim, what files would those be? I’m unaware of any specific approach BGLs.

I had a flight into EBBR on Sunday. With westerly winds it was pleasing to see landing traffic use 25L and departures 25R. It does seem to be hit and miss as to how P3D determines runways.
 
Approaches are coded into the airfield bgl. Open it in ADE and go to the Approach page then open the list of approaches. If there are lots of GPS approaches then it’s likely JustSim has either created new approaches or imported the stock ones into their product. If there aren’t, then they’ve simply updated an earlier product. As a comparison, open the stock airfield and compare the list of approaches.

You can, if you wish, delete the JustSim approaches and (via the Tools\Load Stock Data menu) import the v5 approaches. Keep a backup of the JustSim bgl in case this doesn’t work, but it may be worth a try to see if it results in more prototypical behaviour.

All that said, if you’re changing the wind after opening the scenario it’ll take some time for the AI engine to catch up as all the AI scheduled at the point of the wind change will still use the default runways - and that can mean a 15-20 minute delay before traffic starts using the ‘correct’ runways. If, on the other hand, you’re opening the scenario with the wind preset it should work correctly from the get-go.
 
Hi Tim,

In the scenery folder for EBBR there are three APP_ files but I've disabled them by renaming the extension to BG#.

How does that affect the situation? I always run ASP3D prior to starting P3D so the weather is injected as soon as the simconnect handshake is performed.
 
Hi Ray, sorry about the delayed reply. In short, I've no idea what APP files are. I don't own any JustSim products, and I've no idea how they construct their airfields. They may have a proprietary format that uses some form of proxy to access the MS/LM approach construction protocols. If so, it would suggest that that's where you're likely to find a solution. Have you contacted the developer? I would suggest that's probably a sensible step.

As I said earlier, the default airfields produce the expected result with wind direction changes, so its not anything LM have done that's producing the anomalies you're getting.
 
Hi Tim,

Sorry for the delay. Watching tennis! ;)

I tried a flight from EGLL to EBBR this morning and from ASP3D knew winds would need a 25 landing. On approach the Ai were using 19 but with winds of 220/10 that's perfectly okay. I landed on 25L.

The developers have long abandoned any P3D support so I wouldn't expect an answer. I appreciate your help and I've learned what APP files are even if I don't use them.
 
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