Modelling PAPIs in P3D v4.5

[LecLightning58]

Is it possible to model the unit supporting a PAPI or VASI light in P3D v4.5? I have tried to install a PAPI and so far can only model the lights. Also, the PAPI lights look a little on the large size compared with e.g. default. Is there any way to decrease their size?

 

[gadgets]

You can both replace the 3D model with one of your own and adjust the size/brightness of the light. It's all explained in the user manual. Note, however, if you reduce the size of the lights, you'll also reduce the range.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Does this mean that within the tools of AFLT, it is not possible to use any available 3D model in P3D v4.5? I apologise for my miscomprehension of the user manual, but I guess it does state that such models are only available for FS9/FSX?

 

[gadgets]

is it possible to use any available 3D model in P3D v4.5?

Not sure to what models you are referring. If to the lack of models in the Base Models subfolder P3D, AFLT generally uses the FSX models for P3D (which, unless the models were very sophisticated, would be identical to their P3D counterparts) However, if you've got a compiled-for-P3D PAPI model you want to use instead, just name it PAPI_VASI.mdl and put it in the P3D Base Models folder. AFLT will use it instead.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Apologies again, but I seem to be mssing the point altogether. I believe that I am following everything correctly to position PAPI lights, but the physical structures are not being used and do not appear (the lights appear). Must be doing something wrong!

What I have done:

1. Created the project
2. Loaded the runway concerned (PHBK).
3. Added the PAPIs from the popup window
4. saved the placement data
4. Compiled the data

The lights appear but not the mounting structures concerned.

 

[gadgets]

Sorry. I was focusing on your mention of Flightsim versions.

Open your Documents\Prepar3D v4 Addons\AFLT for P3D\Scenery\scenery folder and check there's a file named "AFLT_projectID_Bases_X.bgl" in it. If not, please advise. If it is there, then please zip-up your project folder and send it to me.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Apologies for the delay in getting back to you. There is indeed a file AFLT_PHBK_Bases_X.bgl in the scenery folder.

Attached is the project folder for your inspection.

 

[gadgets]

I have compiled your PAPIs along with the stock PHBK. Both the lights and the 3D models display as expected.

I suspect the issue lies in the scenery priority. Here's my reasoning. Stock airports are loaded first, then addon scenery. Hence , in my test, the AFLT lights are of higher priority and display normally. What's different in your case is that you have two addon packages, the one containing the airport, and mine in the Prepar3d v4 Addons folder. The SDK is not clear about which would have priority. I suspect your airport is of higher priority than the AFLT models (which are in the file I asked you to check) and that your airport contains some exclusions one of which is clearing the 3D PAPI models. The lights would not be affected since they are rendered as SimObjects, not scenery.

I'd like you to try 2 things, please. Move your airport file into your Documents\Prepar3D v4 Addons\AFLT for P3D\Scenery\scenery folder and preface it's file name with "_" to ensure it executes first. If my reasoning is valid, you should see the models. Then, reverse that procedure, i.e., move the file "AFLT_projectID_Bases_X.bgl" into the scenery folder holding your airport. Again, preface the file name with "_". That too should result in the models being displayed.

In the meantime I'll fix a little bug I seem to have introduced into the last release, i.e., PAPIs appear offset both from the runway edge and runway end the same distance as the specification for runway end offset.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Thanks for trying things out and reporting back.

None of your latter suggestions have worked for me, unfortunately.

In the absence of the addon airport for PHBK, i.e. using the stock airport for PHBK, I cannot get AFLT to work. When I create a new project, I direct AFLT to the stock airport for PHBK and receive a message 'the file appears to contain no useable data'. There is something very fishy about my setup compared with your experience.

 

[gadgets]

I'd never tried extracting a stock airport with AFLT. I always let ADE do that for me and then save as a single airport.

However, I have been able to reproduce the error message you are getting and have fixed it.

Re your main issue, there must be something in your addon airport that is suppressing the PAPI models. I don't have the Hawaiian airports package If you could send me the PHBK airport .bgl from it and/or your .ad4 file, I'd really like to "get to the bottom" of this. Since the airport package is payware, perhaps you should e-mail the material to me at don at stuff4fs dot com.

I'll wait until I hear back from you before re-releasing.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

The PHBK airport .bgl is actually freeware and hence I attach the bgl below:

 

[gadgets]

Thanks. It turns out that there are both a freeware and a payware version of "Hawaiian Airports Part 2". I encountered the payware version first so assumed that's what you were using. Knowing you are using the freeware version, I downloaded that package.

I've tried three different configurations with the AFLT lights in the Documents\Prepar3D v4 Addons\AFLT for P3D\Scenery\scenery folder and:

• just the airport .bgl you sent
• all the PHBK files in the Hawaiian Airports package
• all the files in the Hawaiian Airports package

in Prepar3Dv4/Addon Scenery/scenery. In all cases, both the PAPI models and the lights display properly (see attached).

I trust you have attempted to view the models close-up or from behind. (From a distance in front, the brightness of the lights will make the models invisible.) But, if the models are really not being displayed, I suspect you have an unusual file configuration. Perhaps you can describe for me where all the relevant files are stored.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Basically, I am using the Documents\Prepar3D v4 Addons\AFLT for P3D\Scenery\scenery folder for AFLT and the airport scenery files are in Program Files/Lockheed Martin/Prepar3D v4. I still do not understand why I cannot display the models. I have tried using the stock airport and still no models displayed.

Also, by payware version of "Hawaiian Airports Part 2", did you mean the FS Dream Team version, or are there different versions of the other source available?

 

[gadgets]

By "I am using Documents\… for AFLT", I assume you mean you are leaving the AFLT-generated files where AFLT places them. There should be no need for you to move or add to the …\AFLT for P3D folder. As for your airport scenery files, I was hoping for a little more detail. Have you given any consideration to some other 3rd party file suppressing the PAPI models? If some other file in an active scenery folder contains an exclusion for this area, perhaps it's the culprit. If you have any other scenery/terrain/etc on your system that affects the Hawaiian Islands, try disabling it/them.

Re the payware version, yes, I was referring to the FS Dream Team offering.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

I have now made some progress using the stock airport and stock scenery for PHBK (no 3rd party Hawaiian scenery or airports activated). I have until now been using 'VERY DENSE' as the complexity setting for the PAPIs. If I use 'NORMAL', the models are now displayed for the PAPIs. It would appear that the 'DENSE' or 'VERY DENSE' complexity settings for the PAPIs prevent the display of the PAPI models themselves. I am not sure if this intentional or unavoidable on your part but please let me know either way.

Also, one other thing, the first time I compile the data with a new project, I get a 'Index is outside of the bounds of the array' message which seems to be non-fatal but I am not sure if this a bug. I am using version 4.1.06 of AFLT.

 

[gsnde]

Also, one other thing, the first time I compile the data with a new project, I get a 'Index is outside of the bounds of the array' message which seems to be non-fatal but I am not sure if this a bug. I am using version 4.1.06 of AFLT.

I have that as well, and I am also not seeing any of the light I have placed (setting Normal).

Will dig deeper to give you more details after work, but wanted to second the index error and the invisibility issue.


From mobile hence short

 

[gadgets]

LecLightening 58, Very Dense as the complexity setting for the PAPIs means they will not display when the complexity setting of your scenery (Options/Scenery/World/Scenery Complexity) is below Very Dense. If you want the PAPIs to always be displayed regardless of your scenery complexity setting, set your PAPI's to Very Sparse.

Re the exception, since the Compile menu item remains disabled until you enter some data, it may also be helpful if you sent me project folder for the new project and instructions for duplicating the issue

Martin, I don't get the exception when I compile, so there must be a data dependency. Please send me your project folder.

Don

 

[LecLightning58]

Thanks for explaining the complexity settings. I think the hot weather in the UK has got to me!

The exception message appears after following these instructions:

1. Create the project (PHBK)
2. Load the runway concerned (PHBK).
3. Add the PAPIs from the popup window
4. Save the placement data
4. Compile the data

The exception appears when you first try to compile the data, but the operation still works.

Attached is the project file:

 

[gsnde]

Hi Lec.

Can you verify if your AFLT add on folder contains a add-on.xml file.

In my case it was missing, and I believe the first time compile error you and I are seeing comes from the fact that the xml file creation fails when creating that folder.

That also explains in my case that I did not see any of the new lights.

Thanks Don for that great analysis! I should have spotted the missing xml....

From mobile hence short

 

[LecLightning58]

Martin, yes it does look as if when the add-on.xml file is missing, then the error appears with the first-time compile of the data.