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You mean something like this?
, Rafa and Mike, keep doing your jobs, and Rafita, you are owing us some more info on the progress of your work.
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my DC-8 Project
- Thread starter Mr.FaosFX
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You mean something like this?
, Rafa and Mike, keep doing your jobs, and Rafita, you are owing us some more info on the progress of your work.
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Sort of A lot bigger though, and it will be a flying radio controlled model, powered by 4 electric ducted fan impellers sized for the JT4C nacelles the DC-8-21 used. It will be appx. 150" long or 3.81M, the fuse will be 3 parts for transport. Approximately 45 pounds with appx. 22 pounds of thrust or more.
Anyway, sorry for the thread drift guys. I am extremely impressed by the sim design work and really look forward to more progress.
A lot bigger though, and it will be a flying radio controlled model, powered by 4 electric ducted fan impellers sized for the JT4C nacelles the DC-8-21 used. It will be appx. 150" long or 3.81M, the fuse will be 3 parts for transport. Approximately 45 pounds with appx. 22 pounds of thrust or more. Anyway, sorry for the thread drift guys. I am extremely impressed by the sim design work and really look forward to more progress.
I'm still working away at the landing gear, but overall progress could be best described as "glacial". So I won't post another update until there is something worth showing.
In terms of drawings, I couldn't find much except for the three way line drawings that Mr. Faos mentions early in the thread for a 70 series variant. Those drawings don't have dimensions.
There is also a document published by Boeing for airport use that has some three view drawings and dimensions and a few cross sectional drawings, the latter ones being not bad at all. This document is on Boeing's web site.
I did buy a couple of manuals from a site called Flight Manuals on CD, one for United and one for Universal Airlines. Both have some basic three way drawings (for a 50 series, which is pretty much the same as what you want aside from the engines) with most of the principal dimensions given. It might not be reasonable to buy one of those just for such basic drawings and information, but it would certainly help you to some degree.
I have tried to use photographs as much as possible, combined with known measurements. Photographs can be quite useful if you exercise some caution and bear in mind how perspective works. The best photos are the ones taken with long lenses as they minimize the foreshortening of perspective and appear almost as orthogonal views. I find that I can measure in pixels the size of some known dimension (the passenger door near the front of the plane is six feet high for example) and then have a scale to measure other parts so long as they are a similar distance from the camera. But there aren't many planform views available.
In terms of drawings, I couldn't find much except for the three way line drawings that Mr. Faos mentions early in the thread for a 70 series variant. Those drawings don't have dimensions.
There is also a document published by Boeing for airport use that has some three view drawings and dimensions and a few cross sectional drawings, the latter ones being not bad at all. This document is on Boeing's web site.
I did buy a couple of manuals from a site called Flight Manuals on CD, one for United and one for Universal Airlines. Both have some basic three way drawings (for a 50 series, which is pretty much the same as what you want aside from the engines) with most of the principal dimensions given. It might not be reasonable to buy one of those just for such basic drawings and information, but it would certainly help you to some degree.
I have tried to use photographs as much as possible, combined with known measurements. Photographs can be quite useful if you exercise some caution and bear in mind how perspective works. The best photos are the ones taken with long lenses as they minimize the foreshortening of perspective and appear almost as orthogonal views. I find that I can measure in pixels the size of some known dimension (the passenger door near the front of the plane is six feet high for example) and then have a scale to measure other parts so long as they are a similar distance from the camera. But there aren't many planform views available.
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Great info, I agree about camera lenses. That leads to a lot if issues and internet bickering on RC model sites where guys compare photos to plans that have been drawn up but the problem is the plans are 2D and "sometimes" unfortunately, they are looking at 3D images from wide angle pic, etc to base their perspective on.
I'll check the Boeing site for sure, thanks. You don't have a link do you? What I need more than anything is the measurement on the passenger window tear strips (the metal ring around the windows). Plus, the dimensions of the fuselage radius of the lower fuselage lobe. (I just found the nacelle sizes for the JT-4 in my Terry Waddington DC-8 book - great resource).
I also have the same -63 line drawing I've imported into Sketchup and have sized it appropriately for my needs and drawn my plans around the basic dimensions to be sure to get the relative scale correct. I have some dimensions of the -63 vs. 21 wing and fuse differences so that was easy to fix. Also fixed the errors in the drawing - very minor. It's easy to get everything mathematically correct in a program where as the drawing was made from a human on a drafting table (still amazingly good but some very small errors between wings, etc).
I have several old UAL flight manuals for the -63 from an old colleague of mine who flew it!! But the drawings are very basic and more operationally oriented (like where the gear is, how to oversteer for taxi, nacelle clearance for bank limits on landing, etc). Heck, I hope I still have it, I wonder where it is now.
Thanks again for the update, it's been a pleasure seeing the work you guys do.
I'll check the Boeing site for sure, thanks. You don't have a link do you? What I need more than anything is the measurement on the passenger window tear strips (the metal ring around the windows). Plus, the dimensions of the fuselage radius of the lower fuselage lobe. (I just found the nacelle sizes for the JT-4 in my Terry Waddington DC-8 book - great resource).
I also have the same -63 line drawing I've imported into Sketchup and have sized it appropriately for my needs and drawn my plans around the basic dimensions to be sure to get the relative scale correct. I have some dimensions of the -63 vs. 21 wing and fuse differences so that was easy to fix. Also fixed the errors in the drawing - very minor. It's easy to get everything mathematically correct in a program where as the drawing was made from a human on a drafting table (still amazingly good but some very small errors between wings, etc).
I have several old UAL flight manuals for the -63 from an old colleague of mine who flew it!! But the drawings are very basic and more operationally oriented (like where the gear is, how to oversteer for taxi, nacelle clearance for bank limits on landing, etc). Heck, I hope I still have it, I wonder where it is now.
Thanks again for the update, it's been a pleasure seeing the work you guys do.
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Here is the Boeing document:
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/airports/dc8.htm
The useful information is scattered through the document, you will have to scan through most of the pages to find it all. See page 32 for the fuselage cross section. I seem to recall there is an error in one of the vertical dimensions on that drawing. I can't remember exactly, but I think one dimension was incorrect -- it shows an exterior measurement when it should have been to the cabin ceiling, or something like that. Anyhow, there was an error that caused me to have to scrap my entire fuselage at one point and start over again.
Can't help you with the window tear strips.
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/airports/dc8.htm
The useful information is scattered through the document, you will have to scan through most of the pages to find it all. See page 32 for the fuselage cross section. I seem to recall there is an error in one of the vertical dimensions on that drawing. I can't remember exactly, but I think one dimension was incorrect -- it shows an exterior measurement when it should have been to the cabin ceiling, or something like that. Anyhow, there was an error that caused me to have to scrap my entire fuselage at one point and start over again.
Can't help you with the window tear strips.
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Yes I do but I am busy with some other matters at the moment. Mostly financial after my relocation. Akso, my PC is on the floor, because of the posture I have to be in to use it, I end up with knumb fingers and pain at joints. I should be back on track soon I hope but I did say before I left, possibly by late Feb. I have been doing some work but not for long periods of time like I used. Hopefully, everyone is patient.
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Faosx there is a very usefull invention for that called "table", usually are square, very usefull for place things on.
I can't avoid to the joke.
I can't avoid to the joke.
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Just wanted to report I started modeling the head for the captain. Intetesting, itd been sort of trial and error. Human modeling is different from making aircraft. I will be trying my spline drafting the next three days, hoping to make some progress with possible update by Saturday, no promises tho...just have some free time this week and I want to invest it in the project. March is looking really good though, so that is good news, as usual keep tuned for updates, I know its been slow but I am still here, and the dc8 is still going strong.
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Modeling a head
Head tutorial:
http://www.secondpicture.com/tutorials/3d/3d_modeling_of_a_human_head_3ds_max_01.html
By the way, did you ever get that landing gear parts catalog, and if so, was it any use?
Head tutorial:
http://www.secondpicture.com/tutorials/3d/3d_modeling_of_a_human_head_3ds_max_01.html
By the way, did you ever get that landing gear parts catalog, and if so, was it any use?
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Landing gear work continues
Here is a view of the work in progress on the main gear and then a view of the overall progress as the landing gear takes form. I have done very little on the nose gear, but have made some good, if slow progress on the main gear. I seem to be spending a lot of time just staring at photos and the one detailed drawing I have of the main gear. Most of the folding bits appear to go off in odd angles -- I still have to rotate the folding struts forward at the inboard end. If I don't get all the geometry close to the real thing, it won't animate properly. The tricky part of the animation -- how the struts are folded with gear retracted will not actually be visible, but I still want to get it right.
Here is a view of the work in progress on the main gear and then a view of the overall progress as the landing gear takes form. I have done very little on the nose gear, but have made some good, if slow progress on the main gear. I seem to be spending a lot of time just staring at photos and the one detailed drawing I have of the main gear. Most of the folding bits appear to go off in odd angles -- I still have to rotate the folding struts forward at the inboard end. If I don't get all the geometry close to the real thing, it won't animate properly. The tricky part of the animation -- how the struts are folded with gear retracted will not actually be visible, but I still want to get it right.
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planform photo
Hi-res photo showing a DC-8 63 from directly below with landing gear extended. Mr. Faos might find this useful.
Here is the URL: http://www.nasm.si.edu/webimages/highres/WEB12012-2011h.jpg
Your browser may re-size it to fit your screen, but the full image is very big and high resolution.
Hi-res photo showing a DC-8 63 from directly below with landing gear extended. Mr. Faos might find this useful.
Here is the URL: http://www.nasm.si.edu/webimages/highres/WEB12012-2011h.jpg
Your browser may re-size it to fit your screen, but the full image is very big and high resolution.
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Ill have an update on mine in a few hours. The tricky animation is how the universal joint swivels with the downlatch link brackets...it isnt clear what their stow position should be.
Im doing whatever looks best.
no progress on human models...ive been fooling around with the dc8 landing gears the last few hours.
If all turns out well...wing tips are next and thdn an export release for the HJG team to test out...it has been a while, I hope you guys know I am still here, I have my new pc stand now and can work like before on the dc8.
Later all and Michael, those pictures look awesome, shes looking real good...nice tires.
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Im doing whatever looks best.
no progress on human models...ive been fooling around with the dc8 landing gears the last few hours.
If all turns out well...wing tips are next and thdn an export release for the HJG team to test out...it has been a while, I hope you guys know I am still here, I have my new pc stand now and can work like before on the dc8.
Later all and Michael, those pictures look awesome, shes looking real good...nice tires.
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Hey Michael, today I just learned that the links assembly the folding parts are not at an angle!!!!!! They are actually in-line with each other...the photos play tricks on your eyes. If you look closely you will see that the part that connects to the main shaft is actually offset to the front to allow the system to be in line. Maybe im not making any sense...im already redesigning my system and it should animate with no problems but, youve got to make sure that the parts are the correct length or it wont work.
Ill have more on this finding later.
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Ill have more on this finding later.
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Rafael, I am very interested in this as I am having a hard time determining how exactly they fold up. I know the folding parts are offset somewhat to the front where they attach to the main shaft, but I haven't been able to determine exactly how much. As far as I can see can't fold up on top of the main shaft when it's up because there isn't room. I am thinking that the horizontal rod to which the upper folding bit attaches rotates to allow some sort of folding up partly in the horizontal plane. Anyhow, if you have some insight into this I'm all ears.
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The part that connects to the main shaft does swivel, it has what is known as a universal joint it allows that area to pivot left, right, up or down...in the stowed position it should end up twisted ... The down latch links...note that one is longer than the other to allow this to happen...their purpose is only to support the weight of the system...they to pivot at the shaft connection via a ball bearing!
Ill have some more info later.
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Ill have some more info later.
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My re design was a disaster, the system worked but it seems impossible for the universal joint part, its like the shaft never fits...I backed it up and reverted to the original system which I have fully working.
The animation looks ok if you arent getting into the inner workings but anyone who goes in for a really close inspection will find that the parts end up going through each other near the very end.
I cant upload many pics as ill eat up my data plan on this phone, so weekly updates, till I get the net on my PC like before.
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The animation looks ok if you arent getting into the inner workings but anyone who goes in for a really close inspection will find that the parts end up going through each other near the very end.
I cant upload many pics as ill eat up my data plan on this phone, so weekly updates, till I get the net on my PC like before.
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