FS2004 Extending scenery help

[FS9ER]

Hi,

I'm trying to expand and extend LEBL with aprons close to the water coast however when I taxi on an apron surface close to water the aircraft physics reacts as the apron is missing.
The wheels are picking up dirt and the plane shakes as it is being ran on normal ground despite having a big apron all around with concrete surface.
Any help how to solve extending terrain aprons please.

I have drawn where I added the apron.
I have added exclusion rectangle and add polygon to flatten the terrain but it didn't work.

 

[tgibson]

I see no aprons within the square you’ve drawn, except a tiny one at the end of the runway. Is that the one you’re talking about?

 

[FS9ER]

No, the image is the default one, I only showcased it that way to show until where I added a big apron along with flatten terrain and exclusion rectangle.
The square drawn represents the area where the big apron will be at. I won't be adding exactly that same apron, I just made it look like that to have all that big area set and clear to build aprons and taxiways properly without the planes looking like they are parked and taxiing on terrain ground surface. I'm sure when users build an airport this is what they do first, they set and clear a big area of the terrain ground surface to be editable for parking, taxiways, etc...
So here's the actual image.

 

[Chris Eve]

Which software are you using to generate your flatten?
Normally a flatten will remove all the lumps and bumps you seem to be experiencing.
An exclude will simply eliminate any scenery components, so shouldn't be an issue in this circumstance.
Your description suggests your flatten isn't being created correctly.
Try initially setting your flatten 50ft higher than the surrounding countryside, then it'll be obvious that it's there.
If it doesn't show up we can look into why.
Try the attached file. I've set it to 15ft, so it should be "close" but it'll demonstrate whether it works or not.

 

[FS9ER]

I'm doing everything in ADE and I've tried your file and this is what I got...
By default I think the area is already flatten it's just that when the apron gets close to water I get the physics as like the plane is running on terrain ground instead of concrete apron, for example.
A runway will be added close to water coast too, should I set it along with taxiways, buildings etc... and then set this thing to flow properly?

 

[Chris Eve]

I'm not familiar with ADE unfortunately, but your results suggest to me that you've got some other file(s) interfering.
Have you double-checked for any other instances of LEBL on your system that you may have "forgotten about"?
AFCAD2 may be limited (in comparison) but one feature I do find useful is that if I type in an ICAO code it'll list every instance of that airport, define whether it's "Stock" or "Mod" and where the file(s) in question reside.
I find it useful to have my "Development" folder at the very top of the list in my Scenery Library, that way anything I'm working on "should" supercede anything else below it.

 

[FS9ER]

I don't have any related files to LEBL. I'm using stock scenery with stock airport, I opened stock airport in ADE and started building it.

 

[hgschnell]

The rectangle does not look like an apron because of the different color (lighter grey)?
Your ADE file would be interesting (.ad4).

 

[FS9ER]

Lighter grey is an apron, it's concrete surface, you can choose different types.
Here's my file anyway. I only added an apron. When you taxi some places close to water or get far from airport runways but still on the apron your plane will still react as you're taxiing on terrain ground surface.

 

[GaryGB]

Hello:

A SCASM flatten would "flatten" and "level" FS9 terrain, but may not truly "smooth" the FS9 SurfaceType to disable roughness and the dirt effects seen where the aircraft wheels contact the ground associated with aircraft "GroundRoll" attributes evoked by terrain SurfaceType .

To fix this, IIRC, one may use a legacy SCASM "smooth" FS Surface attribute 'hack' created in MCX under the Special Tools pulldown menu:

XML Apron to SurfaceType converter.


MCX PDF Manual:

8.7 XML Apron to SurfaceType converter

With the XML Apron to SurfaceType converter, see Figure 8.7, you can make SCASM SurfaceType
commands that ensure that your aprons are smooth and don’t show dirt behind the wheels, based
on BGLComp aprons defined in a XML file. This technique can be used if you want to see the
photoreal scenery below the apron.

After selecting the XML file to load and the SCA file that should be written, you can press
the Convert button and the SurfaceType commands will be written to the SCA file you have
selected.

Figure 8.7: XML Apron to SurfaceType converter


GaryGB

 

[hgschnell]

Lighter grey is an apron, it's concrete surface, you can choose different types.

You are right.
Your apron is larger than the stock flatten in FL948170.bgl s. pic:

The stock flatten (and your ADE) is correct on 3.657M. The stock airport background has the same shape in AB948170.bgl.

SBuilder9 is the tool to define larger flattens and background bgls.

Because I have installed UT Europe, payware mesh and payware Airport, I cannot create these files for you.
I suggest you create a smaller apron not expanding on the sea.

regards
Günther

Edit: GaryGB had another tip in between...

 

[GaryGB]

Hi Günther:

I thought I had UT Europe installed, but my inspection of the active FS9 Scenery.Cfg suggested in my current FS2004 install that I do not.


When I inspected the scenery in a live flight at LEBL, I was surprised to see how close to IRL the FS9 default shoreline is relative to LEBL.


If the OP uses some background images in ADE, he could easily fit the IRL LEBL configuration into default FS9 terrain.


I agree that SBuilder for FS9 in combination with ADE9 would prove helpful to this project if the OP is inclined to go into full detail at LEBL.


It is fun sometimes to take a look back at the legacy methods we used to create / mod scenery in FS9 (and to refresh our memories).

GaryGB

 

[hgschnell]

Please tell me what IRL is?

 

[GaryGB]

Please tell me what IRL is?

In Real Life (...as distinguished from the simulation world of FS.)

GaryGB

 

[FS9ER]

Interesting. I will try to finish the build in the coming days. Additionally after a quick test, I added a taxiway along with a runway from the south runway all the way to the sea and the aircraft ran smoothly, no dirt picking up.
Only with the apron it seems on but yes the apron will be smaller, I only made it bigger to see what was causing the dirt to show up or at least to know the boundaries of it.
Just hoping the AI won't have trouble landing, taxiing and parking with new build. Thanks guys, will report when finished.

 

[FS9ER]

Ok so I've finished it and everything seems working flawlessly. Just one question, when you add a generic building and you change its length or width, the texture becomes stretch and result is very blurry, is there an alternative to make it look like original scale but in bigger size?

 

[Chris Eve]

Ok so I've finished it and everything seems working flawlessly. Just one question, when you add a generic building and you change its length or width, the texture becomes stretch and result is very blurry, is there an alternative to make it look like original scale but in bigger size?

Just to clarify ... when you say "generic building" do you mean a library object (in which case there's not a lot you can do, other than choose a different model or re-generate the textures in question to a higher resolution), or a "generic building" as described in the FS2004 SDK (BGLCompSDK p.11), in which case you adjust the length/width/height parameters for the texture? This does cause the texture to "repeat" along the building, but can be quite effective when used appropriately.

 

[FS9ER]

When you open an airport you then right click anywhere on the display, a window will open then put the mouse cursor on add and then you can select the features presented. Generic building is similar as library object but I don't know more of it. So when you select a terminal like in the images above you can then edit it but yes the textures seems to stretch without control for them. What I have been doing for years is add the terminal and keep it original scale then copy paste it several times, then drag them next to each other without too much space left so they can form a big long terminal with original scale textures. Only with this terminal I had to do it that way because it's a very small terminal from the generic building. Another terminal that could be used is the one in stock OMDB, it's much bigger and longer but with different textures but still nice to use when adding buildings to airports. I can't find it in either library object or generic building so I open the stock OMDB copy the object then open the airport I work on and paste it there to have it in the project.

FS2004 SDK (BGLCompSDK p.11), in which case you adjust the length/width/height parameters for the texture? This does cause the texture to "repeat" along the building, but can be quite effective when used appropriately.

What is that?

 

[Chris Eve]

FS2004 SDK (BGLCompSDK p.11) ... What is that?

The FS2004 Software Development Kit ... supplied by Microsoft ... still to be found here https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/resources/categories/fs2004.6/

SceneGenX implemented the "generic buildings" aspect, not sure if anyone else did.

I use it extensively, in a basic manner, but quite sophisticated results can be achieved, with a little effort ... see https://www.fsdeveloper.com/downloads/generic_buildings_for_FS9_and_FSX.pdf

Afterthought :-
I've had a quick look at ADE (not a program I'm familiar with) and it does indeed have some "generic building" capability, but only, as far as I can see, to the extent of a preconfigured set of buildings, which I can adjust for size, but not the texturing.
SceneGenX allows me to "design" a generic building from the ground up ... bottom layer, middle layer, top layer and roof ... and apply texturing to each layer separately.
In a very basic scenario, say for a 20m long building, I might apply a texture at it's default (256 pixel) setting, but if I wanted a similar building 40m long I could apply the texturing at 512 pixels and end up with the texturing LOOKING THE SAME FOR EACH BUILDING, just twice the amount of windows (or whatever) on the second building
In the attached example the right-hand building is 20m square, the central building is 20m x 40m long (with the same texturing doubled for the length on the ground floor only), the left-hand building 10m deep by 20m with the same texturing halved for the depth.
The range of available texturing isn't extensive, but adequate, with a bit of imagination.
If you delve into the depths of ADE you may find similar functionality ... my brief excursion proved fruitless.
SceneGenX can be used simply as a "building developer" should you so wish, thereby retaining your familiarity with ADE.

Further afterthought!
Browsing the ADE User Manual, it's apparently not possible to use ADE to design generic buildings from scratch, but you can import pre-designed generic buildings, so you could use SceneGenX to to develop custom buildings (in some remote corner where they won't get in the way of anything), then import those results into ADE, which you're already familiar with.
Sounds all a bit long winded, but if you've got repeated need for basic custom buildings it might be easier than trying to come to grips with one of the model design programs.

Hope this helps